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Is there a target painted on my back?

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tiltjlp

PN co-founder
Sometimes I wonder why people zero in on one VP memebr at times, and now I seem to be the target, which I find both interesting and entertaining, but not that much of a puzzle. I've been around long enough that I'm probably fairly well known, and as a co-founder of PN, and it's spokesperson or front man, maybe I'm easy pickings. It doesn't really bother me for the most part, but it does befuddle me a bit.

An old new member going by the username of Peepo makes his or her first and only post, claiming that I'm still telling the same old lies. Of course Peepo doesn't mention what these horrid lies I'm keeping alive are.

And then Shockman get upset that after he offered to improve a playfield image for me, I didn't stand solidly behind him in his neverending argument/debate or whatever you want to call his struggles with vpf staffers which led to his being banned.

Now the third example is at least partly understandable, although part of it is a bit uncalled for, I think. Pacdude, who recently removed his tables from here, and who resigned as an Admin, is holding court at vpf again, and this time I'm in his cross hairs. In his version of what happened, he is close to being a knight in shining armor, and I'm the villian. In fact he twisted an e-mail from Jon into believing that he, Pacdude, had permission to run PN however he saw fit.

The only problem was that what he saw fit to do was to carry on a flame war with Phoenixx, posting not only insults right and left, but also profanity filled attacks. He went so far as to repost one of Phoenixx's own post on the front page as a news item, claiming it as proof that Phoenixx was psychotic. When I removed the front page news item, and then moved one of his WIP threads which had become more of an attack and insult thread to the Junk Yard, he over-reacted, IMO.

Since I had stepped down as a moderator, I reconsidered and moved the thread back within minutes. Note that a short time later Jon split the same thread and moved the worst of it to the Junk Yard again. Pacdude's problem was that as an Admin, he should have been helping to set an example, rather than engaging in gutter fighting with a fellow member. Pacdude posted an e-mail from Jon, and well as posting parts of discussions from the Admin forum, and none of what he posted shows Jon giving Pacdude the OK to run PN as his own.

But the part that does bother me a bit, and which I thought Pacdude was above doing. is that he has questioned my beliefs, and how I live my life according to those beliefs. He's done that several times here, and at least once at VPF. What and how I chose to believe is my personal business, and to try to belittle me and cast doubt on my character in such a manner is in poor taste, and as I've said, my beliefs are not open for discussion or debate. I realize Pacdude has been under a lot of job stress, but he should use better judgement.

So it's been an interesting week or two for me. At least I can understand some of Pacdude's hostility, and hope that in time it will lessen. I can even understand Shockman, in light of his bulldog attitude about what he feels is an injustice at vpf. But Peepo is a puzzler. If he can back up his claim that I've been spewing out lies for the past 5 years, why doesn't he confront he with them? Oh well, I can handle this sort of rubbage, I've got broad shoulders.
 
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Shockman

appropriate at this time
"Sometimes I wonder why people zero in on one VP memebr at times"
Sometimes you wonder that? When? When it happens to you?

Peepo, new member? What makes you think that? Because he is using a new name? I don't know why he feels that way about you, but there is obviously some basis for it.

Me, I'll have what PacDude is having. The PMs might have proved something about him to you, but they also proved something about you guys.
Because you did not stand solidly behind me? I don't care where you stand. I care that you would use lies to prop up the other POV though. Jokes? I've had enough of those too. Jokes have elements, like humor and timing and yours had neither.

PacDude, partly understandable? part of it uncalled fore? You think? Your opinion? Try to partly understand this. You were wrong. PacDude was wrong to post to the front page something like that, Over-reacted to your moving his WIP thread? Say's who? you? Fine, believe that, or partly believe that.

"Pacdude's problem was that as an Admin, he should have been helping to set an example, rather than engaging in gutter fighting with a fellow member."
You all should John, you all should.

"he has questioned my beliefs"
Your beliefs. Yeah, that's a tough one. I did too, don't you know. You could find a post where I say John? Buddist? Diamond Way?
That was a question, and a guess. Do you know the Lamma Oli, or just The Dolli Lamma? Have you ever meditated more than 9 hours stright? Have you ever been off the internet or fasted for more than 9 hours stright? Food, connection, etc ready and waiting, of course, and not sleeping, I'm sure you can partly understand that. Before, when I thought you were real, I would have guessed you to be part of that sect that is so rare here in the US, Then as well as now, I would not believe anything more main-stream, it just don't seem to fit.

I can't clear you mind as far as these people, as well as others, I think you can guess who Peepo is though. Rob046, Cowboy, I could add alot, but I could end up in trouble for doing so too. These guys gone because of what they think, or what others think?. I don't like PacDude any more than most people, but I obviouslly like him more than you do. I blame him for Rob, but not Cowboy. I think Rob was hard to listen to as well as Cowboy. That don't matter, and I never tried to get it to matter, I wanted them all to be around if they liked each other or not, and if I liked them myself or not.

I never got into the PacDude and Phoenixx battle. They had a better chance of working that out alone. But you can't keep your nose out of anything, and the more unbalanced the more you want to push it seems to see the fall.
 

subzero

scottish bloke
Y'know what, freedom of speech is a joke around here, people (including me) have been wondering why pacdude left PN, but I think I know why - Pd likes to speak his mind, and that is a damn good quality to have, but its obvious to me there were certain people here who wanted to keep him quiet (2 names spring to mind) If it keeps going the way its going people will begin walking away from PN - what we need is another forum like VPFF - one where people can speak their mind and not get flamed or banned for it.

Ive said my piece, back to the pinball
 

tiltjlp

PN co-founder
What I meant to type, and have edited in my post, was that Peepo is an old new member. And like you, I could come up with a list of possible candidates, if it mattered. As for your prolonged battle with vpf, I do think they overreacted, but that wouldn't be the first time that's happened.

As for the Pacdude thing, my mistake was moving his thread, but I did move it back within minutes. And as for my beliefs, and anyone's, I don't feel that should be a topic for discussion on a pinball forums, much less anywhere. I'm as far from perfect as anyone, but at least I try in my own way. And as an Admin here, I keep my eye on things.
 

tiltjlp

PN co-founder
subzero said:
Y'know what, freedom of speech is a joke around here, people (including me) have been wondering why pacdude left PN, but I think I know why - Pd likes to speak his mind, and that is a damn good quality to have, but its obvious to me there were certain people here who wanted to keep him quiet (2 names spring to mind) If it keeps going the way its going people will begin walking away from PN - what we need is another forum like VPFF - one where people can speak their mind and not get flamed or banned for it.

Ive said my piece, back to the pinball

I couldn't agree more with you, up to a point. It's been shown time and again that totally uncensored and unmoderated forums simply don't work. Freedom of speech shouldn't mean that you have the right to post anything you want, without using either common sense or some responsibility. There were death threats made at VPFF, which everyone should agree isn't a good idea. But I do agree that we all should have the right to make fools of ourselves, which I'm sure I've done often enough.
 

destruk

Pinball Wizard
Site Supporters
Distraught? Not sure what the purpose of your post is except you seem to feel confused. A target on your forehead is more like it. :) And like poor marksmen, nobody can hit the bullseye for the reason why. I think most of these petty arguments show up just because people are addicted to new information - gotta log in every day, or multiple times a day to keep up with all this new data on the internet. Suggesting they don't log in is a crime - it causes withdrawl. I'm tired - when you start looking at objects still, and they start moving, and vivid colors/static shows up, then I need to sleep - that happened about 3 hours ago, so see ya. :) Is anything on the internet really 'that' important? damn...now I'll have to log in later to see what your reply will be.
 

Shockman

appropriate at this time
I just went to look for some of these face things. Look how far back you have to go to see me using one in the past. Don't mean nothin, saw those and chose those. Besides is that my message or someone else's?, Inacceptable!!! ? I didn't put it there.

However I will try to explain this joke. It is that, but it is not off topic, you mentioned VPFF and death threats and who wants that. Is that where you draw the line? Death threats? Is that what nobody wants, so should not be done? If the line is there, who needs a line, and therefore 'watching over'?

Target?, yeah, I can see it. How'd that get there?
 

tiltjlp

PN co-founder
destruk said:
Distraught? Not sure what the purpose of your post is except you seem to feel confused. A target on your forehead is more like it. :) And like poor marksmen, nobody can hit the bullseye for the reason why. I think most of these petty arguments show up just because people are addicted to new information - gotta log in every day, or multiple times a day to keep up with all this new data on the internet. Suggesting they don't log in is a crime - it causes withdrawl. I'm tired - when you start looking at objects still, and they start moving, and vivid colors/static shows up, then I need to sleep - that happened about 3 hours ago, so see ya. :) Is anything on the internet really 'that' important? damn...now I'll have to log in later to see what your reply will be.

Good post Brian . . . so the forums are something akin to Must See TV? And yes, I'm a bit confused, but more astounded just how important some people take all these Internet goings-on. Their poor marksmanship is probably due to the fact that they only want to wound me, so I'll be an easier target. And guilty as charged, I log in several times a day, just to stay connected, or at least that's what I tell myself. I don't really care what people think about me, except for those few cyberfriends I've gotten to know and respect. Anyway, I won't lose any sleep over any of this, but I will await your reply with baited breath. :p
 

Shockman

appropriate at this time
I can't talk for Peepo, I think he hates your guts, mine too probably. I can't talk for PacDude either but I do bet, and I would bet that if he wanted to do you some harm you would know that. He can give his side of the story without being out to get you, don't you think?
Me, I'm comming up behind you right now. But if I was I'd pat your back. In a funk John? happens to the best of us, you'll get over it soon enough. I thought we both could stand up to each other even though you are a staffer. Think nothing of that sign up yonder, it's just to shock the lot.
 

Isaac Sauvage

Meep!
Site Supporters
oh, john. if you'll be waiting with "baited" breath it means you'll be placing a little trap with a tasty morsel inside to catch a passing small animal. i'd like to think it will be a nice, crunchy grasshoper or juicy fly, but perhaps you like to walk on the wild side and there'll be a rat's tail hanging out of the corner of your mouth after the gums have snapped shut.

oh my, that was silly. but really, it's "bated" as in "abated" as in "shallow, quiet and expectant breath".

anyway, i hope over time your friendship with pacdude will recover. there's too few productive people in these scene to let these passing feuds push people apart.
 

tiltjlp

PN co-founder
nicolas.b said:
oh, john. if you'll be waiting with "baited" breath it means you'll be placing a little trap with a tasty morsel inside to catch a passing small animal. i'd like to think it will be a nice, crunchy grasshoper or juicy fly, but perhaps you like to walk on the wild side and there'll be a rat's tail hanging out of the corner of your mouth after the gums have snapped shut.

oh my, that was silly. but really, it's "bated" as in "abated" as in "shallow, quiet and expectant breath".

anyway, i hope over time your friendship with pacdude will recover. there's too few productive people in these scene to let these passing feuds push people apart.

Actually I would hope more for a large pan pizza with triple anchovies. Just proves even old dogs can learn something. I always figured Pacdude and me getting along was more of a peaceful coexistance than a friendship, but I don't hold anything against him. The one factor he seems to ignore in all of this is that moderator or not, and a co-founder of PN, I still had and still have a vested interest in the site being the best it can be. I simply felt his actions didn't reflect weel on the site, or on him as an Admin.
 

Pop Bumper Pete

Pinball Pirate
Site Supporters
don't worry tiltjlp, most of us have a high level of respect for you

but 3 people?
I wish my enemies list was ony 3 people :p

PacDude is being nice, he is building a flipperless table :D
That must have been your influence :agree:
 

tiltjlp

PN co-founder
TheManFromPOST said:
don't worry tiltjlp, most of us have a high level of respect for you

but 3 people?
I wish my enemies list was ony 3 people :p

PacDude is being nice, he is building a flipperless table :D
That must have been your influence :agree:

Thanks TMFP. Only 3 so far, now the rest will probably come a running at the scent of blood. As for Pacdude and the flipperless table, what better evidence that his job stress has gotten to be too much?
 

shiva

Administrator
Staff member
Site Supporters
Sorry to hear John, but join the club. Hopefully, it's not as abusive as what I have had to receive over the years, but it's their site policy now to allow such things to happen, so the simplest thing is to just not go there.
 

bob

Add-a-ball specialist
Site Supporters
Everyone likes me!!!! I guess you guys are just a bunch of losers!!!! :rasta:

I do miss PD though.... He always wore a full body target suit, looked like a Japanese speed skater. :bonk:
 

Shockman

appropriate at this time
TheManFromPOST said:
don't worry tiltjlp, most of us have a high level of respect for you

but 3 people?
I wish my enemies list was ony 3 people :p

PacDude is being nice, he is building a flipperless table :D
That must have been your influence :agree:

Everyone respects him. Most at a high level, that's true.
I don't believe that you have 3 enemies, let alone more.
You know there will come a day.
 

GHoSTFaCe

Pinball Wizard
shiva said:
Sorry to hear John, but join the club. Hopefully, it's not as abusive as what I have had to receive over the years, but it's their site policy now to allow such things to happen, so the simplest thing is to just not go there.
Not that I necessarily agree with anything Pac has said in this situation, but as far as I can tell nothing of it merits staff action yet. VPF isn't perfect Shiva, but it's certainly not the satanic land you make it out to be either. It's just a forum run by less than perfect volunteers trying to do the impossible - make everyone get along and make everyone happy. Still, you are correct, if it's something that is that upsetting, of course the best answer is not to go there. Life's too short to be upset by these silly forums.
 

Shockman

appropriate at this time
but it's certainly not the satanic land you make it out to be either.

Lucky you, getting to come here and state your opinion, is it is? or is it not?
 

GHoSTFaCe

Pinball Wizard
Shockman said:
Lucky you, getting to come here and state your opinion, is it is? or is it not?
I've done nothing but try to be nice to you, and you've attacked me every time. You can blame me all you want, I had nothing to do with you getting banned from VPF.

By the way, it's not "lucky" that I get to express my opinion. I behave. I don't run around kicking and screaming when I see something I don't like, I don't run around calling people liars and thieves, and I certainly don't threaten to go after people in real life. It's not "luck" that I don't do those things, and it's not "unlucky" that you were banned for doing them. I know (well, I hope) you wouldn't behave this way in real life, what makes you think it's acceptable in internet forums? It's not, and like it or not, your actions have consequences.

The one thing I'll never understand is that even though you clearly can't stand VPF and it's staff why you so desperately want to go back there.
 

Shockman

appropriate at this time
It's luck.
I like my actions having consequences, I like others' to also. About the only thing I don't like is when mine does and theirs don't. Go after people? One calls it death, one violence, and now you what? kid napping?

Try to lighten up, you would be a better mod. and may come to understand that I don't blame you for anything. It's just truth, and consequences.
 
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