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my apologies to destruk (if he reads this here) and a invite


Pinball Nudger
First to destruk,

Although you apologized to me about hacking my poll at vpforums, it wasn't a very nice way for you to have done so just because you had criticisms..

nor was it nice for you to criticize , however necessary it was felt, me in the matter you did at vpfreeforums and vpforums about my tables.. such sarcasm wasn't really a constructive thing to have posted... and the bile with which you concerned me and those at vpff that are friends of mine, that wasn't acceptable. but i digress.

i did accept your apology, and i feel it will also count towards the swearing and rude, sarcastic comments you put to me.... Hopefully we both can just let it lie, as the matter is closed to me and i accepted your apology.

As i understand it , i heard you were given d/a or disclipinary action. hopefully, it will be enough to realize that if you have a complaint, you'd have to use in the future when moderating not just more tact, but also compassion and respect for those you want to see improvement in. and maybe some understanding.

But to the others at vpf, they're not so forgiving, and my hurt you gave me, for what you did, as i've said, won't go away and will hurt. And apparently i have quite a few supporters.

A negative aspect, of this is, that pacdude and catalyst have taken what should have been a simple apology that hasn't involved them at all, to attack each other personally at vpf, plus divided vpf and vpff even further, and has threatened the continued support of pacdude in the vp community in spite of his rejection by vpf. It is that debate which i hope you understand is not just getting wordy, but gets disturbing at times.

That is why i hope you understand my request of those discussing the matter aside from me and you, though it is quite closed to me, to come here to flipperless and discuss the issues concerning what you did and what happened to you and me because of it at this forum rather than either vpf or vpff as a neutral ground. Hopefully here, for others it can be settled and things might return to normal (or at least closer to it.) Because perhaps here things can finally be settled without wrongness or insanity for others, without either side's stigams and policies and beliefs biasing the discussions.

Anyway, i feel your apology is still sincere and i still accept it. though for the community's sake, i hope that discussion here might settle for others what it settled for me and you about what happened last weekend.

So , anyone want to continue their discussions here, invite others to debate at this forum, please do so. Cause in the end, the forums vp is disussed on every day since its creation, should be about pinball.

not about site war.




Staff member
Site Supporters
Thank you for your post, Wrenchien.

I understand the issue has been dealt with, my only concern is what I and many believe is a flawed policy at VPF for by not posting any D/A judgements the admin there have left themselves vunerable to division and conspiracy theories. They set themselves apart from us the normal user and create a us and them mentality. If you look to the poll I created at VPF you will find most agree.

Having said that relise this is a moderated forum and no personal flames or abuse will be tolerated. Any actions taken by the moderators will be posted.


I agree with StevOz.

My main focus was/is the fair treatment for all at VPF.
In the cases of Nicky Special (both times), Alex, PacDude, Utplayer, Jive, myself, and a few I might have missed, D/A's were placed out in the open for everyone to see, AND even still discussed today. This violates the 'so-called' privacy rules.
But, if you think about it, all the people I've named are considered troublemakers, so I guess there is fairness for all unless you are considered a "moaner".

I would have done the same if the staff had done this with anybody whether it be, Destruk, Loafer, Bob, Tiltjlp, or even a newbie.