neptuneholographics banned for 2 weeks.

[StevOz]

This is to inform all members that neptuneholographics has been banned for continous personal abuse against all posters he replies to, as unanimously decided by this admin.

 

[GHoSTFaCe]

Great, then in 2 weeks you can ban him again.

You don't honestly believe that 2 weeks off will change his attitude, do you? If anything, I'd guess it would have the opposite effect.

At least something was finally done, thanks for that.

 

[StevOz]

Well I certainly won't be taking bets on him changing, though nothing is certain.

Other solutions, have been discussed and are being worked on, pending the completion of upgrades to these forums.

 

[bob]

Cool... Now we can start the party

 

[kristian]

Good riddance.

 

[tiltjlp]

Thank you Steve. If it were my decision alone, Neptune would have been gone long before this, since I have little if any sympathy for either bigots or fools. Let's hope that Neptune will either get the message and find somewhere else to spew his garbage, or tones down his claptrap. I don't think he has the sense of a rock, but we will see. What we are hoping to be able to do is restrict his postings to the Junk Yard, as that is where all his chatter belongs. So let's simply enjoy a two week holiday from the dolt's ravings and celebrate the season to its fullest.

Happy holidays to everyone, may we all observe the coming weeks in the customs and traditions that we happen to embrace. May the peace of the season extend well into the new year.

John

 

[patrick]

Next time

Very cheap! Dont encourage them!

Why not add a O and replace weeks by years next time? Who agree with that idea? :idea:

Içi c'est Paris et c'est pas en remplacant You par U et are par R qu'on pigera mieux tes conneries, Neptune 2 mer 2.

 

[tiltjlp]

Patrick, that very thing is being discussed among our Admin, and you may get you wish before very long. We want to do what is right, and what we believe most of members would prefer.

John

 

[Anthias]

Hmmm.... That is nice timing :) Since I finally get my holidays and actually have a few minutes to come here and post, its nice to know I can do so without the crap that goes in when he enters a thread.

 

[marv75]

Hear! Hear! Good to see action taken against someone who clearly wants to just cause havoc and strife amongst us!:)

 

[Shockman]

neptuneholographics opened my eyes a bit. Not to any of his views of course, but to some of mine. There is actually tears in my eyes now as I write this and think back on some of the problems I've had with people here and VPF. These are people that range from good to great, and I would have had them think otherwise. I haven't a gay bone in my body, but I would still rather kiss them on the mouth than shake neptuneholographic's hand.

 

[tiltjlp]

I understand exactly what you mean Shockman. People as extreme as Neptune can sure make you wonder about things. His ban will be lifted Wednesday, and we have decided that Zero Tolerance is the best approach. He'll also probably only be permitted to post in the Junk Yard. Should be interesting to see if he survives his first new post.

John

 

[tudnut]

Beg pardon, John (and in all fairness keep in mind that I was one of the few that found little [not "nothing," but little] wrong with his mirroring the tables, and I try to be fair about people exercising free speech...though with limitations!), but isn't it possible to just excise particular postings on here?

I mean, some of his stuff was drivel...which is, for the most part, okay, it gives everyone else a chance for rebuttal...but some of it served no other purpose than to be derogatory and offensive, in which case why didn't someone just remove that post? (I know that sometimes that leaves you wondering where to draw the line, but certainly some of his posts served no other purpose whatsoever other than to be insulting; not much question about freedom of speech there. Besides, contrary to popular belief, that principal does not apply to private discourse...such as this forum. Everyone has to decide for himself and make his own rules about what to allow and what not to. Come on over here and insult some of my best friends and you'll learn a lot about freedom of speech REAL fast! lol)

(On the other hand, playing my usual role of devil's advocate once again, there are always some people around that are...interesting...enough to allow such things JUST for the sake of stirring things up! Is that you, jph?)

Seems to me that if you just erase someone's garbage and pretend it never existed enough times the offending party might learn to calm down a bit and talk civilly if he thinks he has something to say. After all, the only alternative he's being given is to say nothing at all!

By the way, I couldn't agree with you more about people spouting stuff in that "cybertalk" junk. It would be one thing if you were having a casual chat conversation. After all, the very nature of the beast dictates that you respond quickly on your end before you lose your audience (though, even there, I never resort to it, myself).

But if you're posting something that you feel is worthy of being read and understood by others, you've all the time in the world (well...give or take!) to take your time and make sure it's readable and understandable by everyone.

Had I something I really felt was worthy of consideration by a forum of people who only spoke Swedish, I don't think I'd just throw it at them in English and let THEM figure it out!

 

[tudnut]

By the way, on an entirely different tangent (though still relating back to the same thread, especially to shockman!), there WAS something that came of all this as far as I, personally, am concerned, something that he DID "open my eyes" to, and that is the question of copyright vis-a-vis the internet.

As someone who is trying to put together a site (won't go into specifics here), I hadn't really given much thought to it until the constant volleying back and forth between him and everyone else.

So I looked into it...and unfortunately it seems as though every other reference I check is giving the opposite view of the one before it. Some say that everything has to be registered (the traditional viewpoint...and lots of luck registering a site that changes on a daily basis!), some say that it's good as is. The sticking point is whether something is "published"...and I guess the web is still too new to allow for definite interpretations as far as whether it constitutes publication. (I even ran into one site which made the distinction between just posting things on the web..."unpublished"...and making an effort to get that site recognized via search engines..."published." Seems like a very fine line, no?)

I guess we'll all just have to wait and see what the courts decide when push finally comes to shove...like when someone finally sues neptune!!! lol

 

[tiltjlp]

Good to see you around these parts again Tudnut. Last things first for a change, as for copyright, check out the US government's own site for the latest versions of the law; http://www.copyright.gov/ and you'll find that there's a lot more to get confused over than you would imagine.

Now, about deleting posts, that's something Jon and I decided not to do when we co-founded our original site, which was then called The Magic Of Flipperless. Jon simply doesn't believe in censorship, and as a writer, I've seldom seen the need for it. While we have deleted a few posts, the total might only be two or three. I'm not counting own own posts that we might have deleted for whatever reason, which any member can do of course.

As for Neptune, my first instinct was to delete everything he posted, but cooler heads prevailed. Most of his early posts were simply annoying, at least to me. By the time he started posting his racial hate BS, most everyone had figured him out for the oddball/fool/spammer/whatever he is. Our staff decided that allowing his junk to remain posted reflected poorly on him, and taken as a whole, was so dang extreme that it lost most of its punch.

He probably has insulted and slammed every segment of society, although some much harder than others. Besides, our staff has better things to do with out time than to search out and destroy his childish posts, whcih would probably only fuel his ego, giving him more importance than he deserves. And, as Shockman has pointed out, Neptune's views are so extreme, they have made many of us examine our our viewpoints, and even improve out attitudes toward other folks.

So if he returns Wednesday, our staff will be on the lookout for any posts by him. If he starts up again where he left off, he'll be banned as soon as a staffer reads his first post. Zero Tolerance means just that, and he will be informed of that fact before Wednesday. And as for our moderating approach, it's mostly live and let live, when we can. We have decided that a member in good standing, who has contributed to our discussions deserves a little leeway at times. Authors and folks who supply resources for table project will be afforded a bit more leeway still. That doesn't mean that anything goes, simply that we'll try to be more understanding of you or another regular member, or author, than we would be to a first time poster who might not use common sense.

We simply don't see a need to babysit adults, so we don't and won't. But there are limits that need to be observed, and if someone repeatedly ignores those linits we have to do something. Hope that makes sense.

John

 

[PacDude]

I think what John is trying to say is there's a difference between a regular member and a neo-fascist troll. There's also a point where the rights of others to not have to listen to such crapola (not to mention to have to view crapola pictures constantly) outweighs the rights of a neo-fascist to behave like a turd. A poll on such matters show the vast majority of posting members here don't want that kind of behavior on this board and would prefer this individual be banned. We've now made it known we don't want more of that behavior on these forums and if Neptune is willing to stay on topic and not post his neo-fascist racist crap, he will be allowed to stay. Otherwise, we think he should go find a neo-fascist forum to talk with other neo-nazi freaks about how stupid they are.

 

[tiltjlp]

I think what John is trying to say is there's a difference between a regular member and a neo-fascist troll. There's also a point where the rights of others to not have to listen to such crapola (not to mention to have to view crapola pictures constantly) outweighs the rights of a neo-fascist to behave like a turd. A poll on such matters show the vast majority of posting members here don't want that kind of behavior on this board and would prefer this individual be banned. We've now made it known we don't want more of that behavior on these forums and if Neptune is willing to stay on topic and not post his neo-fascist racist crap, he will be allowed to stay. Otherwise, we think he should go find a neo-fascist forum to talk with other neo-nazi freaks about how stupid they are.

That's one way of putting it Dude! BTW, I just emailed Neptune and informed him his ban would be lifted at approxiamtely 12:01 AM Wednesday. I also told him that he may only post in the Junk Yard, and that he may not insult any members nor post any racial or hate comments. We are enacting a Zero Tolerance policy for him, and with the first post of his that violates these conditions will put him back on the banned list without warning or notice.

Since we have given Neptune some pretty strict rules to follow, I would greatly appreciate if no one taunts him, nor insults him. Although I have no doubt that he has not and will not change, I'd rather have him hang himself without anyone helping him do so. Your cooperation is appreciated and needed.

John

 

[tiltjlp]

After more discussion, the PN staff has decided to allow Neptune to post anywhere he chooses. The restrictions on personal insults, racial and hate comments, and now posting of his doctored images will still be in effect, as will out Zero Tolerance approach to him. As I said before, please don't taunt or egg him on. Let's give him a fair chance and see if by some miracle he calms down his comments.

John

 

[tudnut]

I see, understand and totally sympathize with your points.

Still:

our staff has better things to do with out time than to search out and destroy his childish posts, whcih would probably only fuel his ego, giving him more importance than he deserves

...said importance would only be SELF-importance. By virtue of the fact that there would be nothing here to read, there'd be no more importance given him by anyone else on here.

And what REALLY bothers me is that there are always more people ready to listen to some of the crap being spouted by others...and you never know who those people are. While most people on here are finding his stuff to be increasingly ridiculous, who knows how many might be "learning" something new? (Even one person would be too many.)

I live in a town with great rivalries between some sports teams, and one of the notions I've had is starting a site dedicated to a rivalry...but every now and then I run across a site that allows for some postings between such people, and all I see is nonsense at best and HATRED at worst...and realize that it all wouldn't be worth it. Very little is well-reasoned and a LOT is just garbage just spewed out over the net. (And no, that's not my main idea for a site.)

If people would THINK about what they're saying, and provide good reasons for it, then no problem (which is why I got my back fur up a bit when valdimar took me to task so much on my own thread over in vpforums lately, since he was demanding exactly that, though not listening when I tried to provide it!).

But when people just spout off with no good reason, just to disseminate their own views which are more subjective than objective, more emotional than logical, more hate- (or love-, for that matter) oriented than intellectual, then there's a need to put them in line, and keep things in proper perspective.

Example: I daresay a lot of the married people on here love their wives. (I hope so, anyway.) Yet to hear someone continually say that they love their wives would be meaningless to the rest of us, except that it's nice to hear it. (The same would go for those who hate their wives, by the way...though it wouldn't be as nice to hear.) This is a totally subjective thing...until they enumerate the reasons that they love or hate them.

And does that mean that either of them expects US to love or hate their wives in return? Hardly. (Well, the haters might enjoy it; "misery loves company" and all that, and they're certainly wanting of some sympathy. But the lovers probably wouldn't want all of us to suddenly LOVE their wives, also!)

Yet people that go on and on about hating this group or that, fully WANT us to join them in their hatred...and some of us listen to them, and do so. Should they be allowed freedom of speech? Yes, definitely. But should they be allowed freedom of speech ON HERE?

That's up to you guys, but I hope you see what I'm getting at.

 

[tiltjlp]

Some very good points tudnut, which is why we are using Zero Tolerance. If he chooses to post the same junk has has in the past for his first post back, that will be his last post this go around. We'll ban him ASAP and then I'll try my best to convice the rest of the staff to make it a permanent ban. But since we judge the incident, we'll have to wait and see.

John

 

[kristian]

As I said before, please don't taunt or egg him on. Let's give him a fair chance and see if by some miracle he calms down his comments.

John

Come on... just ONE flame John. I've been a good boy and all...

When Bozolino returns and cranks up the juice......he's gonna get a little charge.......somewhat akin to his father when Bozolino was born..... his Pop was an electrician....and Bozolino was his first shock.

 

[tiltjlp]

As I said before, please don't taunt or egg him on. Let's give him a fair chance and see if by some miracle he calms down his comments.

John

Come on... just ONE flame John. I've been a good boy and all...

When Bozolino returns and cranks up the juice......he's gonna get a little charge.......somewhat akin to his father when Bozolino was born..... his Pop was an electrician....and Bozolino was his first shock.

Now that wouldn't be very nice since zinging you back will get him banned again. And you never know, maybe he's changed for the better. And maybe I'm a pinball machine set on free play.

John

 

[kristian]

Okay... it wasn't fair anyway... me flaming his helpless arse.

Let's hope he finds a purpose and meaning to his life elsewhere... and new curtains for his trailer windows.

 

[tudnut]

Wow...two weeks he would've been back now and I've yet to see a post from him. (Maybe I'm just looking in the wrong places?)

 

[StevOz]

Wow...two weeks he would've been back now and I've yet to see a post from him. (Maybe I'm just looking in the wrong places?)

I can confirm, Mr Neptunes account has been unbanned and he can post here if he chooses to do so, see attached.