Help Spinner in FP questions

wild

No Bam no Play
Chat Moderator
Hi to all.

I don't know if this has ever been discussed before ,I've never paid much attention to it, but since I started playing with MJ, VPX.I noticed it

VPX, manages to count the number of laps a spinner makes, and therefore amount the exact score when hit by the ball ... now there are factors to keep under observation which are:
1) strength and speed of the ball,
2) how many laps the spinner has to do based on speed and force when hit
3) on the basis of the laps made, give the exact score

the VPX spinners work very well, considering all these factors, I tried them on the table(vpx) that I am recreating, (MJ),
in FP, instead they don't work well, in the sense that it is impossible (as far as I know) to manage the score, based on the laps that the spinner would do when he is hit.

I tried to make the spinner in toy, simple to do, and create a code with a score based of the laps,that I decide , but it would be a false score, because I decide, how much to make the toy turn, and then to establish a score ,but this it would not be real, like when he is hit by the ball.

I wonder if with Bam, it could be possible to make something more real like in VPX,if any of you have any suggestions, it would be fantastic to make

thanks in advance
 

AnonTet

Pinball Wizard
Site Supporters
Gorgar table has this code that I don't know if it does what you want:

C:
' *************
' ** Spinner **
' *************
Sub Spinner_Hit()
    Velocity = 1800
    SpinnerTimer1.Set True, 20
    PlaySound "DarkLurker"

    If (Lightspinner.State = BulbOn And Not CaptureMode = cModeHell) Then
        AddScore(1000)
    Else
        If (Lightspinner.State = BulbOn And CaptureMode = cModeHell) Then
            AddScore(2500)
        Else
            AddScore(100)
        End If
    End If
    Set LastSwitchHit = Spinner
End Sub

Dim velocity
Dim spins
Sub SpinnerTimer1_Expired
    Spins = Spins + 1
    If Spins >= 24 Then
        SpinnerTimer1.Enabled = False
        Spins = 0
    Exit Sub
    End If
    Velocity = Velocity - Velocity * 0.1
    RotateToy(Velocity)
End Sub

Sub RotateToy(Velocity)
    SpinnerToy.Rotateyz (Velocity), 360
End Sub
 

wild

No Bam no Play
Chat Moderator
All I know about spinners is they can be adjusted in the XML.

in what think they can be adjusted?
I mean, an example you can decide how many laps it has to do?



Gorgar table has this code that I don't know if it does what you want

Thanks AnonTet,
I think this code is have been adapted, to make it better than converting it, into a toy, I noticed this SpinnerToy.Rotateyz (Velocity), 360

But what I meant, is another thing, i.è to the score
the FP spinner,(not toy) when you hit it with the ball, the spinner turns, but the turns that the spinner should do is based on the force with which it is hit, I think this is could adjust in the XML file, as @GeorgeH suggests, but what I would like is, that: I say it with a question....

How many laps does the spinner make when it is hit?

we put the case 3. therefore the score will be 3000 points
we put the case5. therefore the score will be 5000 points, we put the case 1. therefore the score will be 1000 points

the biggest problem is how to create, or determine how many turns a spinner does, it is impossible to know it in real time, just because the spinner is not hit in the same way (strength or speed) every time, and consequently release the exact score

actually it should do it automatically FP, but it doesn't, and therefore it should be created, the problem I don't know how, and if Bam, it could do
 

AnonTet

Pinball Wizard
Site Supporters
I had tough about it and if the spinner was colideable maybe a no renderer trigger could do the trick. But some quick testing told me it's not possible within my knowledge.

Then I peeked and there is a rotation and rotation speed but the former is so it is displayed on the table and the second is not supported by the object (spinner)

I understand what you want. I just didn't know if that code was enough for your needs.
To be honest, unless someone adds that in bam, you're out of luck
 

wild

No Bam no Play
Chat Moderator
Actually the code that you suggested to me is very reliable, I just have to convert the spinner to toy, I had done something similar myself before, but I discarded it,because it seems not to be real, and then there would be the fact that the ball can hit the spinner also from behind, that is when the ball returns,so another code to do.

and yep the spinner cannot be rewritten by Fp,except with the tricks, but I'd prefer it to be real,only Bam I think he can
 

GeorgeH

Flippered Out
Staff member
Site Supporters
in what think they can be adjusted?
I mean, an example you can decide how many laps it has to do?

The two primary parameters in the XML for the spinner is mass and gravity although there are others. All the parameters basically just adjust how fast it spins is all. I don't think it will help you.
 

Popotte

Flipper is good for you!
Site Supporters
Each time the spinner make an half turn, you get the Spinner_Hit event.
So
Sub Spinner_Hit
AddScore 100
End Sub
When you have a complete turn, you get 2 Spinner_Hit.
 

wild

No Bam no Play
Chat Moderator
Each time the spinner make an half turn, you get the Spinner_Hit event.
Yes,JP.....this is the basic rule, simple to do, but that is not the point of the matter

what is impossible for fp, is to manage the "lap" that the spinner should do according to the force of which the spinner is hit by the ball, an example .... in vpx, the spinner works great in fp no .... and I was wondering if with bam it was possible, but surely yes, but I have to involve and tell Rav, and for now this is not a priority

example, if the spinner is hit by the ball at force 5 (obviously here there is also the speed to be taken into consideration) we say that the spinner should do 6 laps, if it is force 10 it should do 12 laps, and just an example .... but this is what fp does not manage .... I hope the concept is clear

so to emulate this, many (including me) create a method with the spinner in toy, which can manage the laps according to their wishes ..... but it is not really correct method .... here you decide who is building the table how many laps to do, and not the ball ..... basically it's the physics that doesn't work on the spinner
 
Last edited:

Popotte

Flipper is good for you!
Site Supporters
No, FP manage this. The harder you hit the spinner, the more laps it does, but it's really a pain to adjust height of the spinner. And I have to agree with you, spinner is not really great with FP.
Concerning making a toy, it's not a problem (now) as you can know the HitSpeed (so the force). You have to decrease this force, but I think it's not so easy to parameter (if you hit the spinner with a very little speed, it have to rotate but just a bit and then return back to its position).
 

wild

No Bam no Play
Chat Moderator
No, FP manage this. The harder you hit the spinner, the more laps it does
for me it is not really like that, it is not like in vpx, even if I hit the spinner at maximum strength and speed, it does not spin as many as it should actually do......he does a few laps, the spinner makes too much resistance to the ball, the spinner has a wrong physics
Concerning making a toy, it's not a problem (now) as you can know the HitSpeed (so the force). You have to decrease this force, but I think it's not so easy to parameter (if you hit the spinner with a very little speed, it have to rotate but just a bit and then return back to its position).
yes in fact I do them in toys, but I use another method that I consider not real ..... as you suggest, you have to use a higher mathematics to make it optimal in standard fp, through toy,I can not do that.

that's why I suggest to use bam, to manage a spinner ..... now it is possible to manage the strength and speed of the ball through this megic code "NewtonPhysicsTick" where it is possible to monitor the ball, even with xBAM.Ball.Velocity .... .and make the spinner in hit_event do how many laps based on these parameters.......the problem is to know how to do it
 
Last edited:

GeorgeH

Flippered Out
Staff member
Site Supporters
...the spinner makes too much resistance to the ball, the spinner has a wrong physics...
You should be able to make the spinner spin more times by decreasing the mass in the XML. These are the settings I use:

<spinner mass="60.0" gravity="100.0" angularDamp="0.25" angularAccel="5.25" spinDampLoose="0.55" spinBackLoose="1.70" spinDampNorm="0.75" spinBackNorm="1.80" spinDampTight="0.95" spinBackTight="1.90"></spinner>

Tomasaco created a custom model of a spinner for Space Shuttle that you might want to try. I thought it worked well, maybe even better than the standard one:

 
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