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Yes, We Can..

JonPurpleHaze

Site Nudger
Staff member
Site Supporters
This thread is about my new president-elect in the usa, Barak Obama, I'm so thrilled that my country and the world has a new future. For the 1st time in my life, I'm proud to be an American and I'm an old fart. I actually cried when Barak Hussein Obama won the state of Pennsylvania and haven't cried for decades.

Yes, We Can End turmoil, the future looks bright to me!
:pint:
 

ValamirCleaver

Pinball Wizard
cartoon20081105.jpg
 

JonPurpleHaze

Site Nudger
Staff member
Site Supporters
Love the image but this election was more than that, folks voted for a new president and his race didn't matter much, I'm thrilled, we just took a giant step forward into the next century.
 

Isaac Sauvage

Meep!
Site Supporters
no doubt, jon- obama is a very gifted, intelligent and effective individual IMO.

i'm proud to be another pennsylvanian who took part in history yesterday. :D
 

JonPurpleHaze

Site Nudger
Staff member
Site Supporters
As mentioned earlier, my tears flowed for the first time in a decade when Obama was declared the winner in Pennsylvania, my parents are from there (Butler) and they left in the 40's to start a family. They raised 6 children in 6 different states and part of my upbringing was a strange catholic group that exchanged and inter mixed my family with African American families. In the early 60's, one of my best friends was a black dude named Terrell that i only saw about 4 times a year. This vote was historic and incredible to me, Yes, We, Can!
:dance:
 

LeeVanCleef

Pinball Lizard
Site Supporters
Early '60s? Wow... you are an old fart, Jon! :poke:
How Obama will be as a president may still be a mystery, but I know one thing for sure... he gives great speech! And, after the last 8 years, it's a relief to have a president that speaks English again! Politics have made me cynical and it's not just Republicans... Carter let the promise of his presidency be destroyed from the outside and Clinton immolated himself like a Vietnamese Buddhist monk, so it's hard not to be prepared for the worst... but I'll be damned if Obama doesn't make me hope for the best!
 

swaffar

Inserted Coin
I'm an American serving in Germany and let me just tell you that their country is three times more F-ed up than the states... They truely do "spread the wealth" over here and let me tell you, it's working for them oh so well... so foreign countries' approval of our precious Obama means dick to me.

Not being a fan of Obama at all, i conducted a (crude) experiment with one of his socialist ideals... i had a long dinner at an average restaurant. Throughout my meal, i discovered my waiter was a huge supporter of Obama. When it came time to pay my check, I informed him I'd be leaving no tip. I explained that I would instead give the tip he worked for to the first needy person I came across. Later in the day I found one such individual sleeping against a parking garage. The homeless man was more than happy to receive the hand-out. When I pondered on what had been accomplished, I concluded that nothing had. The waiter was more than angry to have worked for only his $2.15 and hour(this was on base) with no tip, and the homeless man was no less homeless and had contributed nothing. Moreover he had learned nothing; gained no skill. I'm sure my waiter voted for the left.

Another thing i'm trying to figure out.... how will we cut taxes for 95% of Americans when 1 in 6 pay no taxes?
 
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ValamirCleaver

Pinball Wizard
Not being a fan of Obama at all, i conducted a (crude) experiment with one of his socialist ideals... i had a long dinner at an average restaurant. Throughout my meal, i discovered my waiter was a huge supporter of Obama. When it came time to pay my check, I informed him I'd be leaving no tip. I explained that I would instead give the tip he worked for to the first needy person I came across. Later in the day I found one such individual sleeping against a parking garage. The homeless man was more than happy to receive the hand-out. When I pondered on what had been accomplished, I concluded that nothing had. The waiter was more than angry to have worked for only his $2.15 and hour(this was on base) with no tip, and the homeless man was no less homeless and had contributed nothing. Moreover he had learned nothing; gained no skill. I'm sure my waiter voted for the left.
:roll: :rolleyes2:
 

Isaac Sauvage

Meep!
Site Supporters
I'm an American serving in Germany and let me just tell you that their country is three times more F-ed up than the states... They truely do "spread the wealth" over here and let me tell you, it's working for them oh so well... so foreign countries' approval of our precious Obama means dick to me.
you know what else means "dick"? it's condemning someone or something without giving a shred of fact or evidence to make your case.

Not being a fan of Obama at all, i conducted a (crude) experiment with one of his socialist ideals... i had a long dinner at an average restaurant. Throughout my meal, i discovered my waiter was a huge supporter of Obama. When it came time to pay my check, I informed him I'd be leaving no tip. I explained that I would instead give the tip he worked for to the first needy person I came across. Later in the day I found one such individual sleeping against a parking garage. The homeless man was more than happy to receive the hand-out. When I pondered on what had been accomplished, I concluded that nothing had. The waiter was more than angry to have worked for only his $2.15 and hour(this was on base) with no tip, and the homeless man was no less homeless and had contributed nothing. Moreover he had learned nothing; gained no skill. I'm sure my waiter voted for the left.
he wasn't the only one who learned nothing, apparently.

"spread the wealth" is what income taxes have been doing since their inception, and the only real change that's going to happen is that income tax is going to be adjusted back to former rates. moreover, the point of "spread the wealth" is not to take excesses from the middle class to give handouts to the poor- the point is to take excesses from the rich to help the middle class stand up to these tough financial times.

maybe you ought to learn how to set up an experiment properly the next time you want to try one out.
 

Phoenixx

Starfleet Member
Site Supporters
Giving money to a homeless and evidently poor person, and saying nothing had been accomplished, is like throwing a drowning man a lifebuoy and saying there was no point to it,...
 

LeeVanCleef

Pinball Lizard
Site Supporters
Not being a fan of Obama at all, i conducted a (crude) experiment

Why, yes, it was a crude experiment. It's amazing how many scientific experiments start out with a very clear hypothesis and that, when testing is completed, a completely unforseen result is discovered. Your hypothesis was (if I read it correctly) that raising taxes on the wealthy and cutting taxes for those earning under $200,000 a year would piss off waiters and the homeless. But when actually put to the test, your experiment proved something completely different: you're kind of a douche. :clap:
 

swaffar

Inserted Coin
first of all unemployment in germany has been pretty bad, although it's been getting better over the last few years. secondly, the working are taxed 19% on EVERYTHING. oh, and they also pay taxes on every single electronic device they use... something to the tune of about $2,500 a year for the average computer owning, cable watching home, so dick off with 'no fact'

secondly, yes while the homeless man getting a few bucks (euro) wasn't accomplishing "nothing" it did nothing to further his situation. maybe he ate that day, but what did he LEARN. teach a man to fish..., as the saying goes. those who earn their wealth are entitled to keep the same percentage as the rest of us. it isn't the government's place to step in and enforce charity because, let's face it, that's what taking from the haves to give to the have-nots is.

we will effectively be rewarding mediocrity.

if someone is doing well enough, and feels like giving, i'm all for helping out your fellow man. but that is the sovereign right of the individual, not something that should be dictated by big brother.

i don't get liberals... they'll fight for the right to kill the unborn and use abortion as birth control, and fight even harder to prevent a death-row inmate from being lethally injected. they'll fight to prevent kids from praying in schools, and fight even harder to let gay men marry in a church. thanks to the media, our country truely is skewed.... and i'm not even very religious, just moderate. and i'm sick of being called a racist. i don't dislike obama any more than i dislike a white democrat... but now that he will be in office, i pray no one tries to take a shot at him. that would be ten times worse than him being elected in the first place.

i really don't know why i'm complaining so much... i've been wanting to marry my dog sinse i brought him home from the pound. with the dem's in complete control i'll be able to this time next year.
 
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Isaac Sauvage

Meep!
Site Supporters
first of all unemployment in germany has been pretty bad, although it's been getting better over the last few years. secondly, the working are taxed 19% on EVERYTHING. oh, and they also pay taxes on every single electronic device they use... something to the tune of about $2,500 a year for the average computer owning, cable watching home,
it was a huge job reuniting with east germany, produced instant economic tension, and i'm not surprised there are still some lingering effects almost a generation later. also, my understanding is that high taxes are normal for most euro countries and that the flip side of that is that you get universal health care, the lack of which keeps bankrupting large numbers of americans.

secondly, yes while the homeless man getting a few bucks (euro) wasn't accomplishing "nothing" it did nothing to further his situation. maybe he ate that day, but what did he LEARN. teach a man to fish..., as the saying goes. those who earn their wealth are entitled to keep the same percentage as the rest of us. it isn't the government's place to step in and enforce charity because, let's face it, that's what taking from the haves to give to the have-nots is.

we will effectively be rewarding mediocrity.

if someone is doing well enough, and feels like giving, i'm all for helping out your fellow man. but that is the sovereign right of the individual, not something that should be dictated by big brother.
you missed the point and are now spewing back the exact same point information again. brilliant.

i don't get liberals... they'll fight for the right to kill the unborn and use abortion as birth control, and fight even harder to prevent a death-row inmate from being lethally injected.
personally i say "kill them all!"- there are too many humans on earth IMO.

they'll fight to prevent kids from praying in schools,
hell yea- religion has no place in school or govt and if the last eight years aren't a good example of that i don't know what is.

and fight even harder to let gay men marry in a church.
i agree with you there- a church should be the one to decide what goes on within its doors, assuming it's legal.

i really don't know why i'm complaining so much... i've been wanting to marry my dog sinse i brought him home from the pound. with the dem's in complete control i'll be able to this time next year.
lol... at last, a sign of intelligence and humor. ;)

(that's sarah palin winking, not me)
 

swaffar

Inserted Coin
here's how it goes down... there are lots of turks, arabs, and russians who flock to germany and other EU states. they do the same thing illegal migrants are doing to america; they take money out of the local economy and send it back home to families. (i totally understand why this happens in the states, but that's another topic) anyway, some work when possible while others collect unemployment because they actually make more on it than if they worked! working germans/busisness ownener are enraged by this.
and don't let michael moore fool you. the health care is terrible... imagine if all our hospitals were ran by government, didn't work weekends or federal holidays. of course they have manning for total emergencies, but unless you're giving birth or bleeding to dead, you'll be spending your weekends in a hospital bed waiting for monday morning. i have lots of german/american friends of all ages and most of them have worked/lived in the states of over 10 years. ask any of them and they'd take their medical plan in the states any day.
 

Isaac Sauvage

Meep!
Site Supporters
some good points there, and if phoenix in germany posts again maybe he can comment some about the immigration issues.

but even if what you say about hospital weekends is true in germany i still see it as an improvement over the US. if it's not critical then you can wait a day or two anyway and have peace of mind that you're not going to get raped by deductibles, insurance caps for the year, or premiums.

i'm sure lots of people over there think the grass is greener in the US without realising that the HMO's and the hospitals are businesses adding an extra level of expense to every single medical action. half of all personal bankruptcies in the US are due to medical bills- do they also realise that in germany?
 

swaffar

Inserted Coin
i'm assuming yes. these are all people who've spent a good number of years living/working in america. my landlord lived there for 15 years.
 

LeeVanCleef

Pinball Lizard
Site Supporters
i don't get liberals... they'll fight for the right to kill the unborn and use abortion as birth control, and fight even harder to prevent a death-row inmate from being lethally injected. they'll fight to prevent kids from praying in schools, and fight even harder to let gay men marry in a church.

I don't get conservatives. They'll stand outside an abortion clinic screeching that "every life is sacred", yet they sure enjoy their death rows. They bitch and moan that government is controlling everyone's life, then they run crying to the government to tell everyone who can get married to whom. But, hey, it's America. I support your right to have ill-informed, bigoted opinions. Stay golden, Pony Boy! :cheers:

i've been wanting to marry my dog sinse i brought him home from the pound. with the dem's in complete control i'll be able to this time next year.

How ironic. When I read your first post, I said to myself "that guy's a real dog-marryer." Maybe not in those exact words. ;)
(Dammit, now Palin's winking in my post!)
 

swaffar

Inserted Coin
first of all i'm moderate. secondly, even from a middle-of-the-road stance, i can't understand wanting to reserve the right to kill the innocent... the ones who haven't even had the change to take a breath, yet rally and picket in defense of convicted killers. i'm talking about people who've had a chance at life and made the wrong choices.

should all forms of abortion be denied to women who are victims or are in danger of death due to complication? no. should women use it as birth control? no. i'd like to know how many clinics have running tabs.

it just kills me that the same group of people that defend the freedoms of gays and pro-choice are of the same political affiliation as the ones bellyaching about "in god we trust" or "one nation under god" or simply the word "christmas" all of which hold more a traditional sentiment for me than a religious one.
 

StevOz

Administrator
Staff member
Site Supporters
Nah, he can't be a Christian....right to kill the innocent? How is that possible when all are tainted by original sin and none are innocent, at least ways that's according to Christian doctrine?

Oh yes and congrats Obama, I know he's the best choice, don't envy the job, that's a hell of a mess to inherit over there.
 

Shockman

appropriate at this time
TheManFromPOST made a poll at VPF. Keep in mind that he is the admin there and should be administrating, this part is important. Should political and religious discussions be allowed or not. The members and staffers voted that they should be allowed.

He also made a global warming thread which he knew would be heated.

He wanted the GW poll. Though it has seen some of the most heated debates there, it is still open.

What do rules mean, when policy and the sought opinions of the majority of the members mean nothing. The answer is simple. Nothing.
 

Isaac Sauvage

Meep!
Site Supporters
honestly phil, you are an uberfucking-squared pain in the ass about the VPF staff. i don't have anything else against you and think you are an interesting person otherwise, but you are so far gone on this issue that nothing that anyone will ever do or say will ever make you happy or make you understand about VPF, which i'm sure you will immediately prove for the 10,000 time in your very next post telling me i'm wrong. so yes, this post is completely pointless, but i am so sick of your obsession leaking out everywhere else, like this thread, that i had to blow off that bit of steam. i mean jesusfruckingchrismas, phil... serial killers, celebrity stalkers and anime freaks are all probably less obsessed than you. it's almost miraculous.

phew... okay, i feel better now.
 
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