Tutorial Visual and Future Pinball - How to make Ramps and almost perfect curves the easy way.

shiva

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Continuing from my Pinbuilder videos, where I build a blueprint design in Future Pinball to use in Pinbuilder, (yes I'm weird) I show my method for making almost perfect curves fast and very easy with this simple trick. This example is using ramps but it works with anything that has control points, like walls and light. Fast, simple and very easy. This even works for other editors like PinBuilder as well!

As I continue to work on this design, I will add more videos dedicated to some of the tricks I have learn after nearly 25 years working with vp and fp, and of course, as I am recording videos for my present series, I drop some techniques there as well.

Visual and Future Pinball - How to make Ramps and almost perfect curves the easy way.​


PinBuilder + FP ep 1 - A Marriage made in Heaven?​

 
Handy tips. Never occurred to me to use "snap to mm".

I'm embarrassed to say, I didn't even know about CTRL / SHIFT and arrow keys to move items. That definitely helps with things like ramps big time.
 
Thanks for taking the time to create videos Shiva! I can't wait to see you taking your design and attempting to do more in PinBuilder. There is so much "quality of life" features missing for table creators in PB that it is frustrating.
 
Glad you found this video helpful, and everyone else who saw it. I'm ashamed to admit that I have been using this technique for 20 years, but thought a lot of people have known about it as well. A lot of this type of stuff has been lost over the years with sites closing, some really strange ideas as well especially in the early days, and a couple may still work till this day. If I remember, I will tell everyone how we built ramps when we didn't have the ramp object yet in another video.
 
Another one of my favorite techniques...
My wire Ramps are very different, and I spill the beans on how to make a "modeled" wire ramp without needing to use a modeling program, just FP. I have been using this method for over 20 years, starting with VP, but you have to admit, it looks fricking awesome. It's a pretty short video as well.

 
Continuing from my Pinbuilder videos, where I build a blueprint design in Future Pinball to use in Pinbuilder, (yes I'm weird) I show my method for making almost perfect curves fast and very easy with this simple trick. This example is using ramps but it works with anything that has control points, like walls and light. Fast, simple and very easy. This even works for other editors like PinBuilder as well!

As I continue to work on this design, I will add more videos dedicated to some of the tricks I have learn after nearly 25 years working with vp and fp, and of course, as I am recording videos for my present series, I drop some techniques there as well.

Visual and Future Pinball - How to make Ramps and almost perfect curves the easy way.​


PinBuilder + FP ep 1 - A Marriage made in Heaven?​


To do a blueprint, don't you just click on "File" and then "Generate Blueprint"? ...Or are you talking about something else in the video?

I used to have trouble joining 2 ramps. I will try the snap to grid option more.
 
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I have watched a few of your videos
I think you put more work into your shot design and trajectories than that guy in Tawain (Homepin) does with his real games
 
Funny...
Sometimes you have to do it as well. And sometimes, when you wake up the next day, look at it with fresh eyes and then smack yourself in the head for missing something rather important. Like I did yesterday, so I had to make major changes. I'm rather restrictive with Pinbuilder being in scale only 40 x 20, so I didn't take into proper account the design would be more compressed, so had to redo some things. Think the table will play a lot better though, but we will see...

George, no idea what you are talking about, but the next video, if I remember, I will show you a close up of my ramps and hopefully explain it a bit. You can snap to mm, but you still have to mess with it with ramps, as it's a very different type of primitive compared to the others.
 
George, no idea what you are talking about, but the next video, if I remember, I will show you a close up of my ramps and hopefully explain it a bit. You can snap to mm, but you still have to mess with it with ramps, as it's a very different type of primitive compared to the others.

This is the "File" option I am talking about in the FP editor:

1717093730812.png

This is the "Generate Blueprint" option opened up:

1717093780957.png
 
"build a blueprint design in Future Pinball to use in Pinbuilder"

I think he just meant, creating the layout / design in FP first then use that as a blueprint for his build in PinBuilder... as in the general phrase "creating a blueprint". Not so much the "generate blueprint" function in FP (even though he may use that).
 
Guess you didn't see the other episodes in this series...

Episode 6 is out, and I show what I do with control points on ramps, and show another small trick when 2 ramps are joined together and how I get around FP's "seams" habit, as well as some odds and ends here and there.

 
Guess you didn't see the other episodes in this series...

Episode 6 is out, and I show what I do with control points on ramps, and show another small trick when 2 ramps are joined together and how I get around FP's "seams" habit, as well as some odds and ends here and there.

Hey @shiva - How goes your effort in working with PinBuilder? I'm still having a heck of a time working with the camera control in the editor. I also think there is a lack in PinBuilder for ramps making this transition (from FP to PB). Apart from the ramps though how has your experience been?
 
Feel the same. We all saw so much in this but it never reached that. Even the solutions like being able to multiselect objects are just clumsy and difficult to use compared to fp. Shame it seems to have lost its way and has no direction. Personally it should have been aimed for either beginners or as a advanced editor, but it's stuck in between and lost in limbo.
It's the way she wants it and is not listening to what her paying customers want.
I think we all here could do a better job if we decided to make our own editor, because after 20 years, we know exactly what we want. Pinbuilder is like a 2000 dollar chair your wife buys. It looks pretty, but no one sits in it because it was made to be just looked at, but is too uncomfortable to sit in, so it just sits there in a corner.
Shame. Great idea but bad execution
Not sure what I am going to do with the design. I may work on it more, but no longer interested in making fp tables especially scripting. So may update the design if I am interested enough but I feel the design is nothing special at the moment. It's just firepower with a new ramp structure after all
 
Feel the same. We all saw so much in this but it never reached that. Even the solutions like being able to multiselect objects are just clumsy and difficult to use compared to fp. Shame it seems to have lost its way and has no direction. Personally it should have been aimed for either beginners or as a advanced editor, but it's stuck in between and lost in limbo.
It's the way she wants it and is not listening to what her paying customers want.
I think we all here could do a better job if we decided to make our own editor, because after 20 years, we know exactly what we want. Pinbuilder is like a 2000 dollar chair your wife buys. It looks pretty, but no one sits in it because it was made to be just looked at, but is too uncomfortable to sit in, so it just sits there in a corner.
Shame. Great idea but bad execution
Not sure what I am going to do with the design. I may work on it more, but no longer interested in making fp tables especially scripting. So may update the design if I am interested enough but I feel the design is nothing special at the moment. It's just firepower with a new ramp structure after all

There is a new version of VP being discussed on VPForums. My understanding is that Ravarcade is working on it. I would think Rav would incorporate things from FP/BAM but my understanding is it won't be compatible with FP. However, it has been in the development stage for what seems like several years now and I have not seen any postings on it for months.
 
It's called biting off more than they could chew? Unity is tough to use, and Pinbuilder, which uses Unreal engine, suffers from that. I wouldn't use unity for something like this, way overkill and adds a level of complexity that is unnessarary for pinball and ends up delaying things because of the steep learning curve. You really need to be a Triple AAA programer to use programs like this.
Personally, I would look at Godot with Jolt physics, as it is easier to use, is open source, and has ton's of resources because it's so community based. If you wanted to do something more simple and you are not a high end coder and do like a drop and play setup like PCS, GDevelop would be a good game engine to look at first.
 
It's called biting off more than they could chew? Unity is tough to use, and Pinbuilder, which uses Unreal engine, suffers from that. I wouldn't use unity for something like this, way overkill and adds a level of complexity that is unnessarary for pinball and ends up delaying things because of the steep learning curve. You really need to be a Triple AAA programer to use programs like this.
Personally, I would look at Godot with Jolt physics, as it is easier to use, is open source, and has ton's of resources because it's so community based. If you wanted to do something more simple and you are not a high end coder and do like a drop and play setup like PCS, GDevelop would be a good game engine to look at first.

You should have been on the Unity team.
 
No way they would want me. :)

looking at VPE and what they have done, it looks really good... but only if you are a high end coder or have the specialized knowledge to be able to use it. The vast majority of us do not have that, we either don't have that time to learn or in my case, just am too stupid. Like modern vpx and fp/bam, it was made so only a few people can actually use it because those few have the ability to use these programs properly. The rest of us struggle, it's too complex for our ape brains.

I'm thinking unity is too much, so personally, as a coder that is good enough to write a engine, but not good enough compared to people like JP, I know Unity, Unreal, even godot may be a large learning curve that I just don't have the time or the brain power to learn, let alone use. You have to learn to crawl before you can walk, and these programs require you to run full blast.

How I would do it then, and this is just me, is if I wanted to do a game for development, I would pick a engine (or several) that was based around my abilities. If I didn't know anything, scripting/textures etc, I would start with Scratch, which is made for kids and teaches the absolute basics including scripting structure, and after a few days, I would move up to the next stage of engine, GDevelop, game maker etc, and learn from them. Eventually, I would get good enough to progress to the next level of engine, untill I find the best engine to do what I want.

I mention this because this is a PinBuilder thread, and I feel annah chose the wrong engine, Unreal is too much for her skill level, and the biggest thing is there's no set plan or master roadmap. Everything seems based on what looks cool as opposed to what is actually needed.

Just about every major aspect in fact I would do completely different, and the most important thing is how the person who buys my product uses the product, if it is easy for him and gives him the flexibility and the creativity he requires.

Everything is so awkward and restrictive with Pinbuilder, as a example the logic system just doesn't work well. It's just as complex as scripting and yet it can only do a fraction of the things that writing code can do, and then the actual UI is poorly thought out and very clunky. I'm sure you would agree Max, pretty sure andar would as well on that one. Lot better ways of doing it, the scratch way of boxes and nodes (visual scripting) or the semi coding method of expression scripting used in GDevelop, which is quite good and a lot easier to learn than say C++ come to mind.
 
I mention this because this is a PinBuilder thread, and I feel annah chose the wrong engine, Unreal is too much for her skill level, and the biggest thing is there's no set plan or master roadmap. Everything seems based on what looks cool as opposed to what is actually needed.

This so much. If I knew what is planned next it would really help. I can deal with an editor experience that suffers if I know that is going to be worked on -- and not just by adding one or two additional random and unintuitive hotkeys. The editor experience is what gets me most confused. The lack of trying to even emulate things like Blender if PB stays fully 3D edit mode. I have a full write up of what should be done on the editor side, but PB author doesn't seem to have her attention on editor improvements.. Kinda like "it works for her, so it's good enough"

It's just as complex as scripting and yet it can only do a fraction of the things that writing code can do, and then the actual UI is poorly thought out and very clunky.
I really wanted the concept to work. I completely agree -- if the scripting could have been done using logic blocks (still visual) it would have made this be easier. I think it could be done still and Annah does seem more inclined to improve the logic system. Again though it usually comes with another random weird checkbox or drop down which actually makes it harder to know what the thing does.


Lot better ways of doing it, the scratch way of boxes and nodes (visual scripting)

[EDIT] - Yup what you said @shiva
 
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