Paragon Update?

[jimform2k1]

No love for this widebody classic? Hasn't been updated in years for FP. Maybe an expert builder will tackle this.

Thanks

Jim

 

[Popotte]

I don't think Paragon was released with FP. I started with Rob046 to recreate the table in 2006...
Code is done. I have a nice BG and PF. If you have nice plastics, just tell me.
And with BAM, no prablem to create the 3 or 4 flippers version.

 

[shiva]

I have a copy actually, i don't remember if it was yours or not. Think it was something I was doing with fransico, but never finished. Have a built table, some new graphics, about halfway redrawn, basic coding that is playable so if you want I can send it.

 

[jimform2k1]

I have a few older (2016?) GRANIT/Ghost versions. Graphics are not super sharp and many sounds are missing or wrong from what I remember back in the day.

Thanks

 

[Slippery Jim]

would be great to eventually see this, it was one of my fav SS machines

 

[Popotte]

would be great to eventually see this, it was one of my fav SS machines

Paragon V2.2

 

[GeorgeH]

Paragon V2.2

I upscaled the plastics from this site:

Paragon Plastic Set - 1979 Bally | Shop | Absolute Pinball & Amusements

New, sealed, licensed 1979 Bally Paragon playfield plastic set. These are the last of the “Silkscreened” AKA “Legacy Sets”, which have much more vibrant colors, than the newer digital ink sets. 21-piece extended set, produced on laser cut PETG. Includes duplicates of easy-break smalls, clears...

absolutepinball.com

It could be better but it isn't bad. You can use the attachment if you wish.

 

[pinhead1]

well, there is an old VP version at irpinball.org 70s tables
i play it in 912 or later..
i rotated it, did all the mods for the flippers, slings etc.. for FS.
plays fine in the later VP9 engines.
i think it did have the ball getting stuck problems because of the rotation of the WideBody
all the WB tables had problems of the ball getting stuck when rotated for FS.
had to play in desktop version.
maybe someone could update this old version.

IRPinball

IRPinball is THE site to find free Visual Pinball Tables that have been recreated, no roms required for these classic pinball machines!

www.irpinball.org

 

[shiva]

I was the one that found those pictures, and was asked to help on the graphics, but it ended up never happening and it wasn't something I had the time to do anyway. I was redrawing a bit, just black, but a brief color cleanup as well etc. If someone wants to take this over, fine by me. I still have the psd file so I can send it over and save 30 hours of redraw work. Here's a screen of the plastics, suitable for a table of what I had finished plus the rest of the plastics overlayed. The second was the redraw, just the black lines of what was finished. You can tell there was still a lot of work that was needed to be done.

Found the last fpt file, francisco basic script with additions by me to get it playable. This was one that was to be after Embryon, but he retired and I was too busy afterwards. It's quite rough, but if someone wants to finish it, here you go...

 

[pinhead1]

I was the one that found those pictures, and was asked to help on the graphics, but it never happened and it wasn't something I had the time to do anyway. I was redrawing a bit, just black, but a brief color cleanup as well etc. If someone wants to take this over, fine by me. I still have the psd file so I can send it over and save 30 hours of redraw work. Here's a screen of the plastics, suitable for a table of what I had finished plus the rest of the plastics. You can tell which parts still need to be done.

nice, shiva....
the graphics are fine.
why not use the old images or the irpinball version and change it over to FP and VPX?
it won't play FS unless you have a 50 class tv.
50 class tv is @26inches wide and a WB table is 24-26 depending on the maker
a smaller screen won't work
ball gets stuck.

google---what are the dimensions of a wide body pinball table
AI Overview
Learn more


A wide-body pinball table is generally wider and shorter than a standard pinball table. Wide-body tables typically have a playfield width of around 23.25 inches and a length of around 46 inches. The overall cabinet width is usually around 25 inches.


Here's a more detailed breakdown:

• Playfield: A wide-body playfield is 23.25" wide and 46" long.
• 
  
• Cabinet: The cabinet width is typically around 25 inches.
  
  
• 
  
• Overall Length: The overall length of the table, including the backbox and potentially the kickstand, is usually 51-52 inches.

It's important to note that these dimensions can vary slightly depending on the specific manufacturer and year of the table.


In summary, wide-body tables are wider than standard tables, with a playfield that is approximately 23.25" wide and 46" long. The overall cabinet width is typically around 25 inches.

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AI responses may include mistakes.

 

[shiva]

added the fpt file to images above. As to the graphics, paragon had the best artwork ever done IMHO. It deserves a proper redo by someone willing to take the time and finish it off, the graphics enclosed is a good start, some plastics need to be recolored and fixed as damage is there and the table is playable at least. I'm happy to put it up, as it's a shame to just have it sit there on a hard drive.

I will say this could be a pretty big commitment for someone though. A lot of work would need to be done still.

 

[pinhead1]

shiva#11
>>As to the graphics, paragon had the best artwork ever done IMHO
I will say this could be a pretty big commitment for someone though. A lot of work would need to be done still.<<<
i'm ok with it...leave it alone...it just needs an update to FP and VPX.
i played it in VP9 for years...i'm good.

 

[Slippery Jim]

Paragon V2.2

I have had that version for quite a long time. sadly it is very under done in the rules and scoring and sound features. compare it to this vpx version

 

[Slippery Jim]

I was the one that found those pictures, and was asked to help on the graphics, but it ended up never happening and it wasn't something I had the time to do anyway. I was redrawing a bit, just black, but a brief color cleanup as well etc. If someone wants to take this over, fine by me. I still have the psd file so I can send it over and save 30 hours of redraw work. Here's a screen of the plastics, suitable for a table of what I had finished plus the rest of the plastics overlayed. The second was the redraw, just the black lines of what was finished. You can tell there was still a lot of work that was needed to be done.

Found the last fpt file, francisco basic script with additions by me to get it playable. This was one that was to be after Embryon, but he retired and I was too busy afterwards. It's quite rough, but if someone wants to finish it, here you go...

is there something special I have to do playing a "xse" fp table? I get the following errors trying to load the table, but it does load into the editor, but then I get a ctd when attempting to play it

 

[shiva]

Missing the librarys
Here you go...

 

[Pop Bumper Pete]

re, plastic scans
do you artists need them orientated a 'right' way or does it not bother you?
How about plastics too big to scan? it putting them together not an issue?

 

[shiva]

re, plastic scans
do you artists need them orientated a 'right' way or does it not bother you?
How about plastics too big to scan? it putting them together not an issue?

This depends on the artist more than anything, so I will give out my process. My sorcerer plastics are actual size and very large in file size, even though they were badly damaged and missing bits in them, so it's not tough to resize them smaller. I actually like one master image for all my plastics, that way I can also use that image for metal work etc in the blank spots. (old habit from my vp days) It's just easier for me. I add and rotate each of my plastics to fit and then scale them on the main plastic image. I then warp them to fit properly (using puppet warp in photoshop) as usually the image is not shot or scanned straight down, but at a slight angle so I have to straighten them out. I then line the plastics up with the pf image underneath, and make sure the holes in the plastics match the drill holes in the playfield and adjusting if needed. I usually take a hour/hour and a half for each plastic, and get it as perfect as possible because I have found from personal experience that if I don't take the time, it usually bites me in the ass later on. I then run a couple filters to preserve sharpness and detail, even though Photoshop does a very good job now with resizing.

A lot of devs will just put the thing on a decal etc, but for my particular style, this works the best for me, and I know this way will work the best with fewer problems down the road for how I like to do my games. It makes it easier for say a redraw as photoshop can be quite a heavy load with multiple images, and also for other things like resizing the image. Usually I have a image that is 4096 by 2048, few people have monitors that can display higher, even as a cab, and I would need more memory, as photoshop will chug if I go too high sometimes. It also is best for the user, as too large textures could cause performance issues or even the dreaded white texture error/crashes, so the size is the sweet spot for everyone. But I am sure other devs do it differently, and it is also dependent on the software they use as well.

As to stitching, it's actually pretty easy if you use photoshop (and gimp etc) as long as both images are shot at as close to the same angle and most of us would prefer the same scale (width/length). having 2 images at different angles shot or completely different scales can be a real pain to glue together

 

[GeorgeH]

re, plastic scans
do you artists need them orientated a 'right' way or does it not bother you?
How about plastics too big to scan? it putting them together not an issue?

I have found that rotating a texture does not usually cause problems unless the resolution is poor. Poor resolution can make diagonal lines become quite rough when rotated. It does work best when the camera is positioned directly above the object. Warping is a tricky affair and I find it difficult to get the image just right. I pieced together a playfield once and it is even trickier because of the different camera angles of each shot. Sometimes it is impossible to orient seams perfectly so I end up editing the texture manually to make the seams blend.

 

[Pop Bumper Pete]

With the art work, I feel for you guys.
Currently cleaning and flattening the plastics for Bally's X's & O's, and to be honest, the original art looks like it was done by the work-experience kid at 5.00PM Friday afternoon.
The art and the cutting pattern do not match, there is art that crosses lines.

Keeping it authentic or fixing mistakes?

 

[StevOz]

Keeping it authentic or fixing mistakes?

Well unless it's signed by Picasso I would opt for fixing the mistakes.

 

[GeorgeH]

With the art work, I feel for you guys.
Currently cleaning and flattening the plastics for Bally's X's & O's, and to be honest, the original art looks like it was done by the work-experience kid at 5.00PM Friday afternoon.
The art and the cutting pattern do not match, there is art that crosses lines.

Keeping it authentic or fixing mistakes?

I usually fix mistakes but some of the guys leave them. I remember working on the Twilight Zone. The table had 2 identical repeating sections of graphics on a texture. One of them was damaged and the other was good. It took me about 15 minutes to copy the good graphic and paste it on top of the bad. It made me wonder why the original table developer left it. Maybe they didn't want to take the time to fix it or maybe they wanted it to be authentic. I don't know.

 

[shiva]

Sounds like overspraying. The companies were not known for being a paragon of quality, it was more likely "good enough".