Recommended tables

[bob]

Spiderman is too "kiddie" for him now. He thinks the Hulk is far cooler.

The only Hulk stuff I ever liked was the TV show.

The design is good Bob, but it's the graphics you need to work on. It's not what's there, it's what's not. Some simple additions would make the table better, even though they are just graphics, but graphics are not just something pretty to look at, they also serve a purpose in that they can be used as part of the layout.

I thought it was pretty good for 3 weeks, that's about all the time I can spend on a project, before I start to go nuts.

The biggest one is the background, which stretches from top to bottom. It needs to be broken up, because it makes the table look like a mass of blue. Underneath all that artwork in Trigon is a gradient, Black at the top, to a light red at the bottom, and it makes a world of difference. I would say you need a graphic image up there as well

I love pinball backglass art, but on a VP table, I think it's too distracting to put the backglass behind the table. I prefer a plain black backdrop to the backglass, that's why I try to keep my backdrops simple.

Most of the arcade tables used graphics as pointers for the player to highlight key areas, or to point to where to shoot. Long lanes usually had graphics lines, or a special design that highlighted it. Text was used to describe key areas, and sometimes had graphic borders. Lights had borders, some quite complex, (I would say a spiderweb border would be quite nice) and there were banners with text that was added to make key bonus or special features stand out.

I have to agree with you there.

Bally use to add line work around the bottom, like Playboy. Williams did that, but also added special graphics for the lanes to highlight them like Sorcerer. Most machines did that in fact. Arcade tables, especially EM type, divided the tables into 3 blocks with graphics, the bottom, middle, and top.

You like the pinball era that came after the the one that I liked, I remember avoiding all tables that had digital scoring until that was all one could find to play.

It's a shame you don't know photoshop or psp. Most of this stuff is very easy, photoshop has preset shapes you can download, and there's 10 of thousands of preset shapes. Just drag out the size, fill with the color. If I remember correctly, I used a few shapes in mine.

How do you think I did the graphics on this table?

It's really just decoration that's needed. Sort of like adding tinsel on a Xmas tree, it's not really needed, but it ties the tree together and makes it look far better.

I love Christmas.... Here's my ASM Christmas table. :)

 

[shiva]

Sorry, meant the main pf image that was all blue, not the backdrop.

 

[TedB]

Since Bob and Shiva hijacked this thread,, here an on topic reply :)
Just kidding guys, keep posting, very interesting.

I've got all three. ^_^

Another author I hear lots about, is Sphere.

Also, there's a table called Inner City Life I tried recently. It's got an interesting design, with it's inner workings resembling a cityscape..

Anyone try it?

Sphere made some nice and pretty unusual tables, but I never really liked them enough to play more than a couple of times.
The same applies to Inner City Life. I have it in my original directory, but seldom play it.

 

[bob]

If you actually downloaded and played the 2008 table, you'd see some photoshop work, you'd also see the plastics light up and the area around the plastics and under the plastics light up, not to mention some pretty decent sounds. Here's a little more of a closeup pic.

 

[shiva]

I love hijacking threads. :)

There's nothing wrong with the table Bob, I'm just saying what graphics you could add to improve it. It's little things, but when they add up, they can improve the appearance of a table 100%.

I will use Trigon as a example. Strip the line decoration from around the lights. Remove the lines and the gradients that are used to highlight the shots. Remove the text and small graphics around the targets, and then think. It just doesn't look that great, the small stuff really makes a huge improvement, especially as people are visual.

When you meet a person for the first time, you basically judge that person within 10 seconds based on their appearance. If you meet a Street bum, you will treat him far worse than say a business man wearing a 2000 dollar suit. That's natural with all of us, but it's also the same with everything. The first thing they will see when they load a table is the graphics, and just some simple things can make a big difference.

 

[Crazydan]

I love hijacking threads. :)

There's nothing wrong with the table Bob, I'm just saying what graphics you could add to improve it. It's little things, but when they add up, they can improve the appearance of a table 100%.

I will use Trigon as a example. Strip the line decoration from around the lights. Remove the lines and the gradients that are used to highlight the shots. Remove the text and small graphics around the targets, and then think. It just doesn't look that great, the small stuff really makes a huge improvement, especially as people are visual.

When you meet a person for the first time, you basically judge that person within 10 seconds based on their appearance. If you meet a Street bum, you will treat him far worse than say a business man wearing a 2000 dollar suit. That's natural with all of us, but it's also the same with everything. The first thing they will see when they load a table is the graphics, and just some simple things can make a big difference.

This is true, as far as gaining an audience..

There's a number of games out there dating back to the early 80's, called Rogue Likes, that use only ASCII characters as graphics. Basically, they're loosely based on pen and paper Dungeons and Dragons games, so if D&D is poker, Rogue Likes would be solitaire.

Eventually, they started adding tiles to the games. The older players, they hated this. But, a lot of newer players hopped on board, because now a Bat looks like a bat, instead of a giant letter "B".

But, the graphics are pretty simple, so potential new gamers are still turned off by it, which drives some developers to make more elaborate tiles, and even 3d rendered graphics.

It's the same with what you're saying about graphics and visual pinball tables. And if I may take it one step further, it's also related to why that Visual Pinball installer is so important towards attracting an audience. I wish I had that, back when I was trying to figure out how to put everything together..

On the other hand, some developers prefer to keep appearences and useability simple, to weed out the people who probably wouldn't appreciate the underlying quality of the product in the first place... That's a little self defeating, IMO, but some do have that attitude..

 

[Crazydan]

Since Bob and Shiva hijacked this thread,, here an on topic reply :)
Just kidding guys, keep posting, very interesting.



Sphere made some nice and pretty unusual tables, but I never really liked them enough to play more than a couple of times.
The same applies to Inner City Life. I have it in my original directory, but seldom play it.

Actually, yeah. They have really unique designs, though, especially Inner City Life.

I think I'll try and hunt down some on your list, right after I try Mini Cooper. From the screenshots alone, it looks fantastic, and the author did claim he spent 40 hours on the table alone..

 

[bob]

The thrill of an Original table for me is that I can make the table do whatever I want. That's where the add-a-balls come in for me, I love winning balls and designing a table where you can do this, without having the game last forever. I like simple layouts, because those were the tables I grew up with, I'm 55 years old, so the same games that a lot of people love are the same games that I think killed pinball. I use to get 5 balls per game for a dime and I could win 3 or more games on one game. Then came the computer chip and higher prices and ramps and toys and soon there was nothing left but a bunch of junk machines that were easily broken taking in little money, because no one played them. I don't think I've ever played a Stern machine that worked and played like it was designed to, either that, or they really are junk right out of the box.

This brings me back to recommending tables and waiting for Crazydan to report on my Spider-man 2008 table.

 

[Crazydan]

I notice TedB put VPM in the title post, so I'll recommend a non original table:

(And before I do, I still haven't tried the Spiderman table yet, Bob. Was distracted by Are You Smarter Then a Fifth Grader. )

So TedB, if you like a lot of variety, you should give Baby Pacman a try. It's a coin op arcade game, and pinball game in one.

Neither are exactly great or anything, but I have a ton of fun playing it. In fact, Baby Pacman is the very reason I got hooked on Visual Pinball, because before VP emulation of this calibur was impossible, although it was talked about much on the M.A.M.E. forums.

Unfortunately, I never got to play an actual machine, so this is probably as close as I'll ever get.

Edit: And I think I'll try StevOz's Street Fighter at the same time I try Bob's Spiderman. :D

Putting together something like that with just Irfanview skills is pretty impressive, in my book.

 

[bob]

I reread this thread and there are a couple of more nice Originals I'd like to mention.... Probably the nicest first Original table was The Jetson's by Stein and you can find that at PO, be sure to also download the music pack or it won't seem as nice. Second is the table released by Black & Stein with the unreleased version 7 of VP and it is an executable file, meaning it is a standalone table, which many of us would love to be able to make as you can give it to anyone and there is nothing they have to install to play the table. Great looking table, but I never really liked the way it played, as it is one of those looping shot tables, but most people really liked it. Here's a link where you can download it. Use the download from caiman.us as it's not available on the other link.

http://www.caiman.us/scripts/fw/f144.html

 

[StevOz]

Never liked the gameplay of The Jetsons or that other one, they look great, but did nothing for me gameplay wise, played them both a few dozen times then deleted them.

Oh and I'm still of the opinion you don't need photoshop skills to create a good, maybe even great VP table, sure it helps if you have/can use such, but it's far from the be all and end all, at the end of the day it's an intimate understanding of the VP editor and VP physics and tight modelling within VP that really make the difference.

 

[TedB]

Jetsons are pretty fun, the samples are good as well. Graphics are only one aspect of a pinball table. Good audio samples, good lay-out and a challenging ruleset can make me forget bad or average graphics.

 

[bob]

Jetsons are pretty fun, the samples are good as well. Graphics are only one aspect of a pinball table. Good audio samples, good lay-out and a challenging ruleset can make me forget bad or average graphics.

I agree that just about anything can make a game fun..... Anthias has a VP table called War of the Worlds and I remember enjoying that table a lot and it doesn't have great graphics or detailed VP table objects, it's just a good game.

That reminds me of another nice Original table called "Strife" and it's by Rockinghorse with graphics by Haky.

I recommend both of those tables.

CrazyDan? My Spider-man 2008 table now sucks also, so move it on down the list. :)

 

[TedB]

I have played both tables, and I like them a lot. War of the worlds has nice audio with some interesting elements.

I consider Strife even one of my favorites. Graphics on Strife are very appealing and it plays very smooth. I have attached a picture, I don't think this is a very well known table.

Another absolutely brilliant table I haven't mentioned yet is Doom2 from Lars Thomas Boye. Maybe the graphics are not the best anymore and the pov of the table is not what I prefer, but it has awesome audio samples, lightshow and special modes.

 

[bob]

Wow, I just played 2 games of Daffy Duck 2008 and I must say thath ith don'th thuck. :) A simple add-a-ball game, but it's exactly the type of game I like to play.... Doesn't look too bad, simple graphics, but loads of Daffy sound waves. It's probably too crazy for anyone with "crazy" in their screenname.

 

[Crazydan]

CrazyDan? My Spider-man 2008 table now sucks also, so move it on down the list. :)

Too late!

It's actually a pretty fun table! Nice theme music, too, which is one of my favorites.

It DOES have a tendency to drain balls immediately, but that could just be because I suck and hardly ever nudge.

I could see Shiva's critique about the graphics.. I mean, no ones ever gonna confuse it as photorealistic or anything. On the other hand, it's very nice for a three week project, too. And most important, it's fun to play.

 

[bob]

Too late!

It's actually a pretty fun table! Nice theme music, too, which is one of my favorites.

It DOES have a tendency to drain balls immediately, but that could just be because I suck and hardly ever nudge.

I could see Shiva's critique about the graphics.. I mean, no ones ever gonna confuse it as photorealistic or anything. On the other hand, it's very nice for a three week project, too. And most important, it's fun to play.

I'm glad you tried it. Some balls drain immediately, just like they do on real tables if you don't learn the shots or nudge the table. Seriously, you must learn to nudge to play a decent game of vp pinball. I'm going to tell you how to do it. Put your index fingers on the [z] and [/] keys and the other fingers will automatically be on the shift keys, use the left thumb for the spacebar nudge (but this may take more practice.) Don't change your finger position and it will eventually feel very comfortable. Without nudging, you're not really even playing the table, you could just script the flippers to flip when the ball is near them and then you won't even have to flip them. :) If you want to see what I mean, try out my Daffy Duck table and press the [A] key (autoplay) and the table will play itself. :)

BTW, I just looked and it took me 13 days to make Daffy Duck, so it should be 30% more sucky then Spider-man 2008. :) Check out my WIP thread and you'll see how cheesey of a job I do on making a table. I don't seem to create anything, it's more like I assemble a table. :)

http://www.vpforums.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=44214

 

[TedB]

I'd like to add two other favorites of mine. Not originals this time, but VPM tables.
Medieval Madness by JP and No Fear by Pacdude.

They are both on the top of my list and are probably the tables I played most. I like them so much because of the great interaction with the player. I love the rewards you receive from these tables for achieving something. The tables screaming and shouting and the great light shows are capable of creating a great adrenaline rush.

There are not much tables that give this feeling of interaction. Originals that give me a sense of interaction are Doom2 and Trigon.