WIP Support File BAM FP shivaFlippers 3.2 test table

[shiva]

This is a test of the next version of shivaFlippers, with a example table design included.

This new version is a follow up to the previous test version, based on previous comments and play from youtube videos, as well as new code additions and changes. My thanks to those that tested out the previous version, your comments were very helpful and I suspect you will find this version a lot better and more realistic when compared to the actual real world flippers.

This now uses a variable coil system throughout the flipper arch when you press the flipper button (just like a real table). It is designed to emulate a actual flipper coil in operation, in which the amount of power gradually increases the strength (omega to you devs) of the flipper. This new code will start the variable coil at it's beginning coil when a flipper button is pressed no matter what degree the arch of the flipper is at, at the lowest point, at the highest point, and any angle in between. This means that in theory (remember, FP has it's limitations and bugs) you should be able to do all the things and special tricks that the pros do that require a variable strength. This means flick and tap passes, and I have seen Loop passes as well. (accidental, not based on personal skill)

Because of FP being FP, I set this up by eye, based on a similar era table PAPA video Black Pyramid and Lady Luck

I am very pleased to say that some unique things with the flippers do happen in this new version. For those who do not know what I mean about variable coils, the Lady Luck video has several great examples where a very fast tap of the button just barely moves the flipper, and allows a transfer from one flipper to the next. That is because the amount of power fed into the flipper coil is very weak, so the strength of the coil (and the strength of the flipper) is weak. If you are fast enough, and have decent hardware, you can do that with this new shivaFlipper version, as well as other things in this video.

This new code has been rewritten in places, and also has a new feature that can easily add stronger base shots for ramp shots. This is set to Bally 1982 type flippers, but is fully adjustable for those that like to play with numbers. I have added a more complete description of these settings in the script. The settings are at the top of the script, the main code is at the very bottom of the script.

The test table is fpxEngine with some extras I threw in as fast as possible so you have more to shoot at. I'm using a new flipper rotation chart (anontet) and this version has no walls or triggers. Some of the shots do not line up naturally with the main shots of the table design, but a adjustment of the rotational chart would fix that. The chart was not set up for this table, but actually does a very good job overall.

Give this a good go. This was done by eye and personal preference, if the numbers are good, let me know. I am very pleased with the performance, the slow down is stopped, shots are good, and the variable coil works pretty close to actual arcade flipper behavior just based on the videos I have watched. This improves FP greatly, and when JLou is feeling better and able to work on his DF2 format, if you combine the two this puts FP flippers very very close to on par with vpx flippers, and maybe... dare I say it... even better. :)

 

[NitroNimbus]

This hobby has always been a passion of mine.
Some people talk the talk and some people walk the walk.
Promise this, or promise that.
It is no secret, I don't mind calling someone out if they are dribbling shit..
I always find the hype more or less is a disappointment overall.
The so called un-released DFv2 is a prime example of dribbling shit..
I have had the pleasure of playing both test and sample tables.
But it is so hard giving constructive criticism when ones head is so far up ones arse all they see is sunshine!

So my constructive criticism on shivaFlippers 3.2 test table is as follows:
After testing the table flippers and physics for hours and then adding it to 3 tables of my own I am having trouble finding a fault.
It does exactly what you said it would do. "It does exactly what it says on the tin" not certain if this an American or English term.
You have to be seriously quick with the slightest tap to get a pass right and that is perfect.
It is not bat shit crazy as FP is on the tip of the flipper or no power at all.
But it still lacks direction and although much improved, realistic power half way up the flipper.
This has always been a FP fault, you have improved it all double fold. So not complaining.
I am not certain you have made it to VPX flippers yet, but it is the closest and best I have seen or played on FP.
In all fairness 90% of VPX tables also play like shit, so I am only comparing it to the best tables I like...

So disappointed in the so called FP community for not commenting or recognising this contribution!
Spend some time and actually look at what @shiva has done.
I know I won't get no respect because I tell certain people to fuck off!!
Stop being self indulgent cunts, open your eye's.
Toughen up all you little princesses!!!

 

[shiva]

Thanks for the comments, though I would have to say I would have put them a little bit different way.

First off, about DF2. I have high hopes that the remaining issues can be sorted. shivaFlippers was first started years and years ago, and it has been a long process ever since. I know there has been a lot of enthusiasm last year, but I could have told them it's a long haul, and I suspect they are finding out for themselves that for every one thing you solve in FP, you end up with 2 more problems that needs to be fixed because of it.

I have the latest test version of DF2, it needs a bit more work in a couple places, and it could be a bit better with the ability to modify it as the code is very complex and beyond the capabilities of the vast majority of people, but overall, I do really like what I see. I think the ability to improve DF2 really rests on what Rav comes up, and well, playing with numbers for weeks to fine tune it. Just like I had to do with shivaFlippers, a lot of multiple versions over the years. I do agree with your statement that if people had inputted info a bit more, things would have improved a lot faster, but people don't. They want to do their own thing, so that's fine. A lot of it doesn't interest me, like gates and spinners, so I would rather work on this, JG, and fpxEngine. It would be nice to have help, but this is a long term commitment, and I don't even have the time to work on it, so can't expect others to either. We all have our thing.

Still, watching videos of gameplay really helped me fine tune this new version, and fix a few things that don't happen to me because we all play differently, even how we flip flippers.

As to this new test version. People may be put off because of all the variables I put in so you can modify it, but then the entire purpose of these test versions was for people to play with it, adjust some numbers and see what they think in as easy a manner as possible. On to your comments...

With the base shots, get the right amount of Omega for the flipper overall that you like (shivaBaseOmega, which is set to 18 in the script) and then adjust fpxStrongerFlipperBaseShots= 4.25 to a higher number if you want a stronger base shot. I did everything by eye, and based on that particular game style, so different types of games require different settings. This is new, so very much a simplistic solution, but the easier it is to use, the more people can use it. DF2 has a good solution, so once JLou is feeling better, I'm sure progress will be a bit faster.

After your other comments on the variable coil, then I'm glad I guessed right. I based everything on actual gameplay videos ( but OLDER videos, as modern coils and flipper assemblies are stronger now days than back then) so I am very pleased with how the flipper reacts with little things, like hitting the button halfway down a flipper drop and how sometimes the ball has this weird motion with a slight flick at certain angles of a flipper swing. I noticed it on mine, and thought I had screwed up somewhere, but then saw a world class player and it did the exact same thing, the ball in my version even moved pretty close to that. (In theory it should anyway, still nice to know)

If you or anyone else that can tear themselves away from the sonic game has a test of this, and see's something, then I am always happy to listen.

 

[NitroNimbus]

Well what can I say, being tactile is not my for forte.
But I will as always keep it real.
I am not an overly educated person but I have a general idea.
@JLou5641 is a very intelligent man and I hope he has a speedy recovery.
Every person on this forum is smarter than me, I can't give you advice or comment about ball physics or rotation charts.
I chime in every now and then because even a simpleton can give advice or criticism that no one else can see.
For example. Your 3.2flipper post was going unnoticed and I thought that was an injustice, cheers!

 

[shiva]

The smarter you are, the more stupid your mistakes become.

Doesn't matter about skills, I failed math in high school, or even matter about intelligence, this is just to see if what I have is good enough, and any ideas on making it better or things that could be improved. As you noted, not very many people are commenting, so if that's the case then I have to assume that this code is the most brilliant fully working thing on the planet, and therefore no more changes needed, so I can move on to something else. :)

 

[NitroNimbus]

Well mate it works for me, cheers!!

 

[AnonTet]

Hi shiva. As we talked I'll test it (finally at home again). The ideal would be porting it as I did before but at the moment is just too much assuming from what i've peeked. Seems a little bit easier than before but...

On the good news (and I hope i won't fall prey of placebo) new toy (that I'm about to install) will give me 240Hz of glorious fluidity that I hope improves also pinball experince quite a bit - with pinball being a fast game and all.

 

[AnonTet]

Yep, I won't port the code. No more walls placement needed on the table, but is still a lot to move and edit and I simply don't have the time. The way it is is limiting the use of shivaflippers to the whole framework. Time is at premium among those who delve into development.

Would be nice if you can compact just the _prehit, keyevents, physics and options related to flippers in just one block for C&P and only with the necessary flipper options. And also the old Rav EOS code in Sub NewtonPhysicsTick that you used for flipper delay.

You'll have a PM soon with points on everything I just wrote so prepare for a long PM :D

 

[JLou5641]

Hi All.. i'm back from COVID. But since, it still make me very tired now... Each day, i'm waking up, i go to work, then i go back home, and as soon as i can, i rest on my sofa... I don't have the same energy than before... My PC is "Off" since 3 weeks and my brain too... as soon as i go back home, i want to shutdown my brain and sleep.. .

For me, DFv2 is ready to release, maybe @shiva have suggestion. @AnonTet will make package with some of his table for a pre-release pack.. But for now, i don't see what i could make more. Even it's not perfect ( and it will never be perfect ), it work very great, and easy to implement, with only few update. This is one of the goal.

Doesn't matter about skills, I failed math in high school,

ahaha... me too.

Greating,
JLou

 

[AnonTet]

Lots of us failed math it seems

@JLou5641
While testing shiva's code I've found something that might help on the most pressing issue but I have to find where exactly in the XML is the problem.

I'm on it and keep you posted.

 

[shiva]

Glad you are feeling a bit better. Very busy time for me, have meetings all day despite the fact I am suppose to be on vacation, so by the time I get to this, you guys will be asleep over there. Think you guys are 12 hours ahead of my time or so.