Flipperless Rat Race (Willams, 1983) and other re-creations with BAM

[Gimli]

Here is an update of our progress.

Lots of tweaking left to get it right, but I think Paolo and I are getting there

 

[Gimli]

How do you plan to make it work for cabinet? On mine I have 2 buttons for the flippers and 2 for nudging.
could de nudge be dynamically remapped in FP script to be used as supplementary pair of buttons?
(without the need to go in the control editor)

Great Question !
As I am in charge of coding, I will take the liberty to answer.

Currently we are using the Arrow keys. If your nudge buttons are mappable to key presses. I would simply use the right flipper and right nudge for tipping up and down and the left flipper and nudge for left and right . I don't think you can map the buttons in the FP script...at least I have never seen it.

The real labyrinth table like the one I emulated has a right knob for up and down and front centre knob left and right so that would be similar to what I am describing in your case.

There definitely is a learning curve to program your brain to respond but it is doable. I have a x-arcade tank stick with dual joysticks that I think I will try although I am getting quite proficient with the arrow keys.

I am a Robotron Junkie

I am keen to try this with a player standing at each end of my 50 inch 3d TV

 

[Gimli]

oops

 

[Paolo]

As I am in charge of coding, I will take the liberty to answer.

Thanks Bob

 

[polygame]

Sorry Paolo, I'll say this the most diplomatic way I can, It is not interesting to interact with you anymore.
You don't get the second degree in conversation and it is frankly not a pleasant experience.

Most of your demise come from the translator you use I think. We all try to be friends here.
Stop feeling attacked by every comments, you are not helping your likeability.

 

[Paolo]

Okay, that's your personal opinion, Steve, but I don't think everyone thinks like you.
I didn't ask you to interact with me, Steve, but I respect your opinion, but I absolutely don't agree with you

if I am not likeable, for you, I will make a reason for it, but this does not stop me from saying what I think, it does not help my sympathy, patience, the important thing is that I do not offend anyone

I don't feel attacked by anyone, I answer on the basis of what I read, it is not the translator's problem, I understand very well what you all write.

don't worry, Steve, if not interesting for you, interact with me, if you want, start you,to not interacting with me

but that doesn't mean that others have to do it, and it doesn't seem fair to me that you say it, and as if you were telling everyone here, don't interact with me.

if I, don't like to you, you don't have to tell others.

if for all of you here, it's a problem interacting with me, tell me clearly, I'm going to my house.

don't worry, Steve, and those who think as you, I finish this table with Gimli, and then I go to my house, so you have no way to interact with me, never again, both you and those who as to think, as you

 

[polygame]

seriously, the translation is awfull. I give up.

 

[Paolo]

seriously, the translation is awfull. I give up.

Steve, why do you say the translation is awful?

do you also do the translation?

I want to understand, what's wrong with my comment, I replied to your comment, but I'm saying it kindly, I don't think it's offending you

but you are of nationality like Bob? he understands me, and you don't? let's talk, of this my translation,if i did something or says of wrong ,i'm the first to apologize

 

[Gimli]

Ok...here is our progress with Rat Race.
We are working on some bugs
Wild has done an amazing job on the table building, lighting and sounds.

We used Gin's Gas Segment font for the timer

My laptop is tool slow the video below is using FP Renderer and not BAM "new" renderer

@wild
@Ike Savage
@GeorgeH
@Gin

 

[GeorgeH]

Cool!

 

[AnonTet]

Really cool. Think you can make it work with a trackball, If it doesn't already?

 

[Gimli]

Really cool. Think you can make it work with a trackball, If it doesn't already?

Hi Anon
Only if trackball can be assigned to keypresses

 

[Isaac Sauvage]

Hi Anon
Only if trackball can be assigned to keypresses

Easy enough to do with a small 3rd-party key-mapper, if FP doesn't have device-mapping / key-mapping already built-in.

Personally I've used RB-Joy for years due to its compact size & unobtrusive nature, but there should be many alternatives of course.

Anyway, game looks really interesting! Somehow the sounds come off better than in the VP version.

Looking at the video, playing this game also comes off as rather gruelling. That is, having to rush, yet be precise at the same time. Whoof!

 

[Gimli]

Easy enough to do with a small 3rd-party key-mapper, if FP doesn't have device-mapping / key-mapping already built-in.

Personally I've used RB-Joy for years due to its compact size & unobtrusive nature, but there should be many alternatives of course.

Anyway, game looks really interesting! Somehow the sounds come off better than in the VP version.

Looking at the video, playing this game also comes off as rather gruelling. That is, having to rush, yet be precise at the same time. Whoof!

When we are done I am keen to try it on my 50 3d TV in Cabinet mode.
It is learning process to get good at like joust, defender and robotron and other Williams games I suppose. I am very proficient at it now but fear players wont give it the time it takes

 

[BlkSbth1970]

Ok...here is our progress with Rat Race.
We are working on some bugs
Wild has done an amazing job on the table building, lighting and sounds.

We used Gin's Gas Segment font for the timer

My laptop is tool slow the video below is using FP Renderer and not BAM "new" renderer

@wild
@Ike Savage
@GeorgeH
@Gin

is the version for download in the first page of this post up to date? If not would it be possible to get an up to date version. This like the Joust Pinball table intrigues me

 

[Gimli]

is the version for download in the first page of this post up to date? If not would it be possible to get an up to date version. This like the Joust Pinball table intrigues me

Thanks !
Wild is testing and has some lights and sounds to add...but I would love to nominate you as an official tester....if you check out "labrynth" thread and download the easy and hard versions you wilĺ get a taste of how it will work...although I have fine tuned it a little since then

 

[BlkSbth1970]

Also side not about rate race when i load it up it shows up as a new table and only the score reels are rendered the table isnt

 

[Isaac Sauvage]

It is learning process to get good at like joust, defender and robotron and other Williams games I suppose. I am very proficient at it now but fear players wont give it the time it takes

Good point. I could see others wanting to check it out due to novelty, but then being becoming bored / frustrated because it was too unlike pinball and required a certain amount of unique skill.

I'm thinking that polishing it up visually might help. As long as it keeps running on my system I should be able to offer advice.

Even the original colors on the prototype version, well... I'm not sure they were optimized in the first place. Rat Race has kind of a borderline green-and-red Xmas theme, whereas I can't help thinking a blue-aqua theme might have been more visually appealing, I don't know.

 

[Gimli]

Also side not about rate race when i load it up it shows up as a new table and only the score reels are rendered the table isnt

We decided not to post playable wips of Rat Race, but that may change soon as we are getting close !

I LOVE IT !
Having loved Labrynth, Joust and Robotron it is like a second childhood...although my wife will rightfully contend my first chilhood never ended :)

 

[Gimli]

We decided not to post playable wips of Rat Race, but that may change soon as we are getting close !

I LOVE IT !
Having loved Labrynth, Joust and Robotron it is like a second childhood...although my wife will rightfully contend my first chilhood never ended :)

If people wish to re-invent the playfield image at some point that would be cool.

For now we are trying to replicate the original although that may exile it into obscurity like its forebearer

Oops I just replied to myself....oh well nothing new :)

 

[Isaac Sauvage]

If people wish to re-invent the playfield image at some point that would be cool.

For now we are trying to replicate the original although that may exile it into obscurity like its forebearer

Oops I just replied to myself....oh well nothing new :)

I need to take a closer look at IPDB's photos. From the VP version at least, I got the sense that a certain amount of texture, detail and possibly lightings FX were lost in the VP remake. 'Less than perfect' photos would probably bear most of the blame.

Bob & Paulo, it does seem like you're in the process of improving that whole situation, given the 'underlamps' you've added and overall better detail. Nice work, you all. :)

Still, I'm kinda wondering how much farther we can take the realism stuff, just to more re-accurately simulate the original, but TBH I might just be sniffing paint chips here, not sure.

The summer air has me feeling a bit 'artsy' these days, and maybe I could do some quick sketches to visualise certain RR details based on the original, but also just to sketch out some hypotheticals, for example along the lines of the blue-green scheme I imagined. If that makes sense.

Eh, my previous online sketches are attached to a different username, so I should probably PM them rather than post them publicly. Can do.

 

[Isaac Sauvage]

I hope I have been clear and helpful

Paolo, I really appreciate all your good work, helpfulness and clarity (clearness), lately. You've stepped it up, nicely. :)

I don't understand a lot (the majority, frankly!) of this FP stuff, but it's still fun to follow along with the various projects. (the images / screenshots also help, so thank you for those, too)

Me, I'm playing around a bit with alternate color schemes for Rat Race. I'm starting to think a brick / earthy color scheme would be nice, or the blue / aqua one I'd mentioned. As mentioned earlier, I think that the more attractive this table looks, the more people will feel like playing it, even if it does feel a bit frustrating or like 'not pinball.'

IPDB doesn't have the best shots for the game, but I like these closeups I found earlier today. They help show the different materials and opacity / luminosity / etc:

EDIT: For some reason I first posted this in the billiards thread. Moved here, since it makes more sense.

 

[madmrmax]

This is a great job everyone involved! I can't believe how far FP and BAM has gone to produce something like this!

-mark

 

[AnonTet]

I didn't even knew such thing exists in real life. Great stuff!

Seems to be challenging but fun.

 

[Gimli]

This is a great job everyone involved! I can't believe how far FP and BAM has gone to produce something like this!
-mark

Thanks Mark !
It is really cool what Rav has done with BAM ! I have a had a great time with this !