920

[Isaac Sauvage]

idiot.

if he spent $65 on a MO that you're holding uncashed and AJ sent him $65 then it means he's at even money, not up $65.

 

[Isaac Sauvage]

oh, whoops! i actually logged on here just to say that i'm an average user again. not an admin, just an average user.

thus my first statement here as an average user at VPF:

OMG, WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU FASCISTS AT VPF!?! poor shockman has been the nicest guy in the world about his whole thing and you have treated him like dirt! you have lied and misled him at every turn! you've gone out of your way to make him so frustrated that one time he had no choice but to send your mailboxes 10 PM's in one day!

that's just inhuman, and i hope you people rediscover your humanity soon and grant poor shockman the clemency he deserves! being on staff clearly cast an evil spell over me, but now that i'm a regular member again mine eyes have been opened to justice.

DOWN WITH THE INHUMAN FASCIST DICTATORS AT VPF!

and since the election is coming up soon:

SHOCKMAN FOR PRESIDENTTTTTTTTTTTTT!!

 

[Shockman]

Phil, you owe me $65

If that is true, and it was a money order and not a check he is even, and just trying to get up another $65 by saying I owe him another $65. Even plus $65 = +$65.
While I was in the hospital, my son and mother came over to the house and placed gifts, teapot, etc, and did some cleaning. My son threw out a lot of junkmail and receipts and things and I think it was with that, as I thought it was, and I can't find it. I will send a personal check. If the exchange rant is in your favor that's fine, but if you want more than $65 US you better let me know. I will not allow someone to even think I owe them money, I'd rather pay you, or pay you back if you will.

 

[Shockman]

There is some truth to what you posted '.b
I have been the nicest guy, and I have been otherwise, you know exactly when that changed and why. You have treated me like dirt, and have lied and misled at every turn. You have gone out of your way to extend my frustration, but I did have choices. It's not inhuman, I use to think it was, but you have educated me otherwise, thank you, truth is always best. I do deserve clemency, and I did not deserve a ban, for a remark I made that you misunderstood, or even AC restriction for a year, let alone a ban for a year. You guys were arguing with me that my $65 donation should not be returned even if you did ban me or confine me to the AC, when I had, unless you lied, nothing on my record but one warning, and never even got a two week ban, which should have come before a year ban.

Don't try to blow this out of proportion '.b. Everyone knows, even those that would never admit that they do, because they have seen what it would be like to be straight with you. Many, and I mean many, have said something though, even those that you never expected would, like AJ and Bob.

I could have handled it better, but so could you guys, even to this day saying I owe another $65 to VPF, for crying out loud. I'll pay it, I'll give you another $65 because you say I owe, and you must believe that if you would say it in public like this. But I'll say again in public, that you owe me something as well, and that is my membership that you said you would give back to me.


I really thought that money was sent out of your pocket, Peter, so you would be able to say you owed me nothing. You want it back, though you got it back, but you don't want to give what you said you would. Yes, if you say I owe you $65 dollars, you will get it. it's just money. I say you owe me that chance to come back to VPF, I assume, to be square, I have that now?

 

[Pop Bumper Pete]

I have never said that if you do A,B,C, then I will let you back
Making you jump through hoops is not my style

All I ever wanted was for you to understand WHY you were banned, for if you had been able to understand, this mess would have been over a long time ago

I want you back, that is the truth, that is why I keep coming to PN and explain my self over and over to you
but without your understanding, there is no return

 

[Shockman]

I have never said that if you do A,B,C, then I will let you back
Making you jump through hoops is not my style

All I ever wanted was for you to understand WHY you were banned, for if you had been able to understand, this mess would have been over a long time ago

I want you back, that is the truth, that is why I keep coming to PN and explain my self over and over to you
but without your understanding, there is no return

I told you that I understood. I have told you that you had good points, and I have asked you if you thought I had a point as well and that's where that round of discussion ended.

What you want me to say is that it was all my fault. I will.

It was all my fault, everything I made up, and never happened. I understand fully why you did it and I would have done the same thing in my right mind, which has eluded me for awhile. I was out of line to ask you to understand my point, as it don't matter. You are the boss, and I should have followed the rules whatever changes they went through. I believe you want me back and I thank you. I was angry, but had no reason to be.
I understand why I was banned.

 

[Shockman]

I assume you are going to be chief admin. at VPF now Peter. Just tell me what else you want me to say. If you want $65, fine, it's on the way. If you want me to say I never had a point and it is all my fault then I will, if you want me to say again that I understand, I do. You pick how VPF is going to be run now, and you pick how you are going to run it.

If you really want me back, but I have to be the only one that shows any bit of understanding, I'll show that, in order to be back. If you want it that way, if you want to start your tenure that way, then it's Ok, because it's your way. I was hoping for a little give and take on both sides, and I hope you don't hold me being honest about that against me. But if you really want me to capitulate mono, then I'm willing.
I have always understood your position, you never even considered that I may have one. You just thought I was out of line. Well I was, I said some very mean things. I'll say you were not out of line. I'll say you never was. I say you never will be if that will help. Is that what you really want Peter, me to say it was ALL my fault. I could have got by, I do understand that as well. I could have conformed. So it was mostly my fault. I could have avoided it if I was a good little boy.
You see Peter, I really do understand, but you already know that. What do you want me to say?

 

[StevOz]

Well your unauthorized mods will not fly there and whichever way you twist it Shockman they are unauthorized, to authorize means to ask and obtain permission, it cannot be an assumed.

 

[Isaac Sauvage]

I have been the nicest guy, and I have been otherwise, you know exactly when that changed and why. You have treated me like dirt, and have lied and misled at every turn. You have gone out of your way to extend my frustration

i know, i know.

all i can say is that being on staff made me the most evil man on the internet.

if only i hadn't have volunteered for staff the world would have been a better place.

 

[Shockman]

In truth, it did change you a great deal, '.b

'Oz, I disagree. What do you think the reason for written language is? What about the rules of VPF? Can they be read, and assumed? Or do they have no meaning unless they are sought out, asked about and reiterated in person?

 

[Shockman]

au·thor·i·za·tion (ô'thər-ĭ-zā'shən) pronunciation
n.

1. The act of authorizing. See synonyms at permission.
2. Something that authorizes; a sanction.

It was what he did that authorized the mods. He performed the act of authorizing it. What is twisted?

 

[Shockman]

Peter, I'm still getting a message that the account is banned. Also I will mail you $65 tomorrow morning. I would like you to add two dollar signs to my account. One when it is reactivated, and another when you get my next $65. I have to assume that regardless of what I have been told, that AJ has in fact not reimbursed you. If that is correct, you can keep it, if not, you can contribute it to the site in my name, and add the other $ (two is for over $100, correct?).
I want to thank you for this. I was really starting to have doubts, and you have restored my confidence in you.

 

[StevOz]

That's your problem shockman and there you go again assumining that because Pete has suggested a few possibilities that it's a done deal.

Same deal with your assumption about modding PDs tables, you assumed 'free to mod' means free to release mods without the authors consent, which you know he explicitly stated you were not authorized to do so.

The 'free to mod' meant free to create your own personal mods and that he was open to be approached on the release of such mods to the public, that was the intent of the statement, you ignoramus. Nevermind the fact that right thing to do would be to ask permission regardless of what is written in any table info.

 

[Isaac Sauvage]

In truth, it did change you a great deal, '.b

haha, i can see you don't recognise facetiousness for what it is. let me spell it out for you, then:

i was joking. i'm generally pleased with the work i did as admin, got 99% positive feedback and that feedback means more to me than any self-judgement i could make.

i was joking. you have been a relentless asshole from almost day one of when i started. and after all this time you have clearly learned almost nothing from the experience.

i was joking. not only do you not deserve your 115th chance at VPF, you don't even belong on the internet IMO. and that's really saying something.

hope that's a little clearer for you. if not, then go hump some barbed wire...

 

[Shockman]

Why would he care how they were labeled then? Why would he care about the revision history. Why would he care about the credits. I have already admitted to being an ignoramus on this matter, I don't understand the objection after the fact at all.

Peter can speak for himself, Steve, and he has, and it was clear, but let's get back to the issue of authorization and some more of my ignorant 'whys'.

Why would he be free to mod the core.vbs file to take out work he did not contribute, but was a benefit to all? Why would any staffer be only concerned about what I did? Why do you think that is fair?

 

[Shockman]

I know it was a joke '.b
I recognized the facetiousness. But it really did change you, and that is the point I was making. Holy cow, nicolas.b. You act like this when you hear off the cuff comments like this and the truth. It's easy to guess that you would take being lied to at least as bad as I do.

 

[StevOz]

It's not about him or his actions, see first post in this thread.

A staffer is not just concerned with what you do, why would you think that?

As for the core.vbs, he was elected by the Vpinmame team to look after that file as I understand it, it's not a staff issue.

 

[Shockman]

Then neither would be modifying the VP exe, which the rules state is an offense. The support files are no different. The support files are basically patches and extensions, and librarys that make VP work with VPM. You host those files, just as you do tables. If Destruk made this point you would agree, but it's not him making it, it's me. You should ask him though, what he thinks about it. Look Steve, I know you know, and I know you understand, You are a coward though. You understand full well that PacDude modded countless tables with that action, mine included. It would be no different than if he would have taken the entire flipper action out of the VP.exe and he had a way to make his tables have flippers. His modding was mean and spiteful and broad. Mine is focused on that very work that I contributed for the good of the community, and was accepted as good for the community, and hushed a slew of ball through the flipper posts, which the staff had so much of that they would instead of answering, would say things like 'search is your friend' and other mean even if helpful comments. If it was your work that he took out he would have been banned before you had a chance to ban him yourself. That is why I would think like that when I say the staff only seems to be concerned with what I do.

And I'm the one doing this 'Oz. I know what it is about. It is indeed about him and his actions.

 

[StevOz]

You know you can call me whatever you like Shockman, it's pretty much meaningless to me because I know popular opinion is quite the opposite, mind you be stupid about it in a repatative manner and you should know what will happen then.

If it were my work, I'd simply contact the Vpinmame team and reason my case for such changes to be put back into the core.vbs.

Actually if it were my tables I couldn't care less, I'd just include the needed script and release an update. You made all those PD tables really?

Also I might add PDs tables have no ball through flipper despite any changes to the core.vbs, so required no fix.

As usual Shockman it's all about you with no responsibility or concern about the consequences of your own actions.

 

[Shockman]

I know, but it should be about everyone and the consequences of everyones actions.
Is that what you would do? Reason your case?
I have reasoned my case.
To answer your question, yes, that is my work in each of those tables. I did not make the tables, I made them work with no ball through the flippers, I came up with the setting used in each of them.
That's my point, glad to see you are finally getting it 'Oz. PacDudes tables were not effected by his action, or he would not have done it. But they are benefiting by the same work, my work. I beat the drum for a core addition, so that it would not have to be done table by table. Editing tables should be to edit them, not to set a reasonable default. I can't put the code back into the core and put it where it belongs, so I have to do this, I have a right to share my work, PacDude has no right to use it in his tables after he took it away from everyone.

 

[Pop Bumper Pete]

Shockman, if you understood why you were banned from VPForums, why do you continue with the same behavior here?
Over the last 12 months you have accused me of being a thief, liar, and generally not being worthy of breathing air!
Sure, I did play a cruel April fools day joke on you (and you would have been surprised at who stuck up for you over that), but show me where I have lied to you?
You have a day ago accused me of trying to swindle you out of money.
You have accused me of stealing your recreations, one cannot steal what has been given away, also I have never even played you tables.
You have in the last month posted that I deserve to die

I trusted you once when I let you back 18 months ago
I have seen no attitude change in you to make me think that you can let the past go

I cannot make Mr staypuft apologize to you (not that he needs to)
Nor am I willing to take the blame in his absence

 

[Shockman]

What are you saying Peter? That that was just another hoop?

You have just last night said that you wanted me back, and that all it would take is my understanding. What about today and tomorrow? The past is not going to go away Peter. It was there yesterday, and you still said that.

I know why I was banned from VPF Peter, and I understand it. Now, is this the way you are going to start your reign? You told me you wanted me back last night and said you would let me back if I understood why I was banned and now, just a few hours later you ask me to tell you where you have lied to me. This was the last thing I expected. You tell me that we can move forward and now you want to go backwards again. I don't want to tell you about lies, I don't want to bring it up ever again. Why would you?

 

[StevOz]

Yes understanding that you refuse to grasp.

 

[bob]

Same deal with your assumption about modding PDs tables, you assumed 'free to mod' means free to release mods without the authors consent, which you know he explicitly stated you were not authorized to do so.

The 'free to mod' meant free to create your own personal mods and that he was open to be approached on the release of such mods to the public, that was the intent of the statement, you ignoramus. Nevermind the fact that right thing to do would be to ask permission regardless of what is written in any table info.

That's bullshit Steve and I think you are even beginning to believe it yourself.... "Free to mod" means just what it says... FREE TO MOD!!! For christ' sake, he has written permission from the author! You can argue all of the points you want with Shocky, but you can't argue this unauthorised mod issue without looking ridiculous.

I also agree with you that Shocky should try to reason with the VPM team about the core.vbs file, but isn't that a little difficult for him to do when none of them come here?

 

[StevOz]

Bovine manure to you to bob.

No bob you are wrong, there is a right way and are wrong way to conduct oneself in such matters, the wrong way is usually the easiest and incorrect path, based upon assumptions without confirmations.

Shockman managed to contact AJ, contacting the VPM team is vastly easier and does not rely on VPF membership. Heck come to think of it you could do it on his behalf, if you're really that concerned about it.

oopz.almost forgot that flash...

http://www.pinballnirvana.com/StevOz/cows_with_guns.swf