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Air_Hockey_Fp/Bam "Ideas and concept"

wild

No Bam no Play
Chat Moderator
I mean anywhere.
I don't know ..... I don't have a cabinet, but desktop, honestly inside the bam menu, I don't remember seeing a part where you can do what you say ..... and if it could be done via script. ... (another solution) in Fp, yes you can configure the keys ....but you can't replace the keys with the mouse....but I think you know .....about in bam this is a question that maybe Terry or George, or who uses a locker can tell you
 

Gimli

Pinball Hall of Famer
That's what I call fast reaction time @Gimli :D
Thanks !
Its surprisingly similar to Billiards

1. Hide or delete the pinball objects and unneeded code from the "new table template"

2.use BAM to level the table

3. Use BAM for enhanced elasticity of side rails (wild has extensive code from Rav that he used for the Backglass vertical playfield in NES)

4. Attach textures to invisible balls

5. Use the new BAM SetVelocity code for directional shooting of primary object "ball".
6. Use the new BAM SetPosition code for placing the Primary object "ball" at desired location at the start of each players turn.

7. The most critical part is using BAM monitoring code for assigning objects like pool cues and paddles based on the active balls lication and speed.

Anyways same poop different pile :p
 

AnonTet

Pinball Hall of Famer
Site Supporters
Thought that the same methods would apply and bam 328 would be needed. Just makes sense. As you so eloquently put it, but now in portuguese and no so eloquently: "Mesma merda, só mudam as moscas" :D

But even when you know how, sending things like this in such a short period of time is still impressive in my book.
 

wild

No Bam no Play
Chat Moderator
Here is a type of hockey cabinet.

mobile.jpg
 

wild

No Bam no Play
Chat Moderator
@ravarcade
@Ike Savage
@JonPurpleHaze
@Gimli
@GeorgeH
@TerryRed
@AnonTet
@Gin
@madmrmax
@romolo2002
@NitroNimbus

😍🤩😎 THIS IS AMAZING!!!

OK, guys, here's the magic that Rav (Rafal) did for this hockey game,we can play with the mouse, it works great it's in all directions ....maybe it is possible to increase the responsiveness of the mouse, but we will see later.

Edit:
it is also possible to increase the speed of the mouse,tested it works very well, really cool!!


 
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wild

No Bam no Play
Chat Moderator
Looks cool. I assume it requires 2 players.
Thanks....G,for the moment I believe that for two players at the same time, and in the same table it is not feasible (then who know), salso because for a second mouse, rav replied like this to Anontet see this
the other you see is AI, "artificial intelligence" that follows the ball (the puck) created by Gimli, uses the new functions, ball position, ball velocity, with miniplayfield and NewtonPhysicsTick, and maybe I forget something, but @Gimli would explain it to you much better
 

AnonTet

Pinball Hall of Famer
Site Supporters
Windows knows they're different devices because of the different IDs. It's just that windows automatically redirects them to the mouse pointer control unlike a joystick. Because of this, I think the support has to come from the software, in this case BAM, reading the different devices like it does with joysticks too.

Let's see where this goes but it would surely be more fun against other people. It is still yet another great improvement anyway. :groupwave:
 

wild

No Bam no Play
Chat Moderator
Windows knows they're different devices because of the different IDs. It's just that windows automatically redirects them to the mouse pointer control unlike a joystick. Because of this, I think the support has to come from the software, in this case BAM, reading the different devices like it does with joysticks too.
I believe that Rav has thought about this ... but I also believe that the work to have two mouse recognized is challenging ... perhaps it is necessary to have special "dll", it is to create an appropriate menu in bam, where we we could configure the two mouse ....but it is all to see.

but there are considerations to be made:
1) two people playing on a desktop pc .... is it optimal?
2) the first player would have the advantage, since he would have the perspective view, instead the second player would be at a disadvantage, he would have the control of the "mouse" in reverse, and if you put the table view horizontally, it would be impossible to play.
3)for those who have a cabinet, maybe it would be better .... but it depends on how they have the cabinet ... if they have a cabinet like a real pinball machine, the second player, where should they be positioned? has the backbox in front ..... it would be ideal a cabinet without a backbox ..... this would be the maximum fun ... but first "we" better(Rav) should solve the problem of the two "mouse"
 

Gimli

Pinball Hall of Famer
I believe that Rav has thought about this ... but I also believe that the work to have two mouse recognized is challenging ... perhaps it is necessary to have special "dll", it is to create an appropriate menu in bam, where we we could configure the two mouse ....but it is all to see.

but there are considerations to be made:

3)for those who have a cabinet, maybe it would be better .... but it depends on how they have the cabinet ... if they have a cabinet like a real pinball machine, the second player, where should they be positioned?
You are correct most people have their cab TV monitors imbedded in a cabinet housing which makes 2 player mode awkward.

But for those with just a TV and no cabinet structure like myself then it is possible.

This works nicely for other 2 player games: Air Hockey, Billiards, and RatRace
 

GeorgeH

Flippered Out
Staff member
Site Supporters
...
2) the first player would have the advantage, since he would have the perspective view, instead the second player would be at a disadvantage, he would have the control of the "mouse" in reverse, and if you put the table view horizontally, it would be impossible to play.
...
You might try rotating the playfield when a new player starts.
 

wild

No Bam no Play
Chat Moderator
You might try rotating the playfield when a new player starts.
🥶that is, you mean that every time the puk is in the player's own half, the view rotates ??? did I get it right?
if so I think they will come, the epileptic seizures ...... with respect speaking
 

GeorgeH

Flippered Out
Staff member
Site Supporters
🥶that is, you mean that every time the puk is in the player's own half, the view rotates ??? did I get it right?
if so I think they will come, the epileptic seizures ...... with respect speaking
I don't know how to do it but you could rotate the table slowly on screen when a new player starts so you don't get epileptic seizures or become dizzy. @Gimli might know how to do it.
 

wild

No Bam no Play
Chat Moderator
I don't know how to do it but you could rotate the table slowly on screen when a new player starts so you don't get epileptic seizures or become dizzy. @Gimli might know how to do it.
the problem is not who can do it or not, with "bam's custom camera" it's easy to do ..... I could do it too .... gimli maybe better than me ... but I don't think it's a good thing. . while I play seeing the view rotate every second ..... I think "we" would go crazy

EDIT:
the exchange of the puck is fast between the two players .... how do you think it would be if the table rotates every tenth of a second?
then there is also the question of the two "mouse" to think about ... I think for now it is something to talk much later
 
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GeorgeH

Flippered Out
Staff member
Site Supporters
OK. An alternative would be to display the table horizontally but then neither player would be able to play easily. At least each player would have the same disadvantage. The only alternative I can think of which might be impossible to implement is to display the table both ways on 2 monitors at the same time. I only have 1 monitor though.

Just some ideas.
 

wild

No Bam no Play
Chat Moderator
OK. An alternative would be to display the table horizontally but then neither player would be able to play easily. At least each player would have the same disadvantage.
with the consequence that it is also necessary to invert the axes of the "mouse",,, it is something that I have said before too, but perhaps it is not possible to play in these conditions.
The only alternative I can think of which might be impossible to implement is to display the table both ways on 2 monitors at the same time. I only have 1 monitor though.
for those who can do it it would be fantastic ..... really very nice to play ...... but I also have only one monitor like you.
Just some ideas.
Welcome you ideas.....please keep having other ideas G .... the ideas lead to Bam's progress .... and we enjoy, so a round of applause to Rav.
 

GeorgeH

Flippered Out
Staff member
Site Supporters
After my brainstorming session, I think your best option would be to not animate the rotation of the screen. I would just have the end user press a key and switch views with no animation. You would need to post a display that says "Player 1 View" or "Player 2 View" and possibly have the end user press a key to switch views. If you build it with the key press, the end user could choose to not press the key at all and play it with one view. It would allow the end user to choose what they want.

I would say that would be your best approach.
 

Isaac Sauvage

Meep!
Site Supporters
Consultant
re: second mouse,
Most modern gamepads have a couple of analog sticks on them. They wouldn't be nearly as nice as a mouse, but an analog stick would theoretically be closer to the smoothness of a mouse than key input.

I don't know if BAM can sample gamepad input, but if not, it's easy enough to use a 3rd party tool (discussed earlier).

So you could at least have one person on mouse and one on gamepad, and that could be interesting. A sort of built-in handicap, if you will. Players could also be encouraged to switch off every other game to balance it out. You could also just have both players on gamepads to keep it completely level.

Regardless, I think creating a decent AI opponent is going to be far more useful than worrying about accommodating a second human player. I recommend playing those "Shufflepuck Cafe" links that I provided earlier, so you can see what it's like to face different AI opponents. Those play right in browser.

Myself, I've had a couple of these Logitech gamepads (attached) for many years. They are cheap (only about US$15-20), very durable, nice quality, and widely available. They have both key-style (digital) and stick (analog) input, so you can switch around on the fly. Sometimes that's quite useful for certain games, when you want to slow down for a moment and use an input that's more precise.
 

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wild

No Bam no Play
Chat Moderator
After my brainstorming session,
what is the brainstorming?......as for what you suggest, we will see later, the developments of the game.
I don't know if BAM can sample gamepad input
I think so .... I would not be surprised if bam could do it ... but for now I want to see the developments of the table .... for now I do not want to be heavy for Rav ... ."time to time", and then who knows!!!
but thanks for your suggestion.
 

GeorgeH

Flippered Out
Staff member
Site Supporters
what is the brainstorming?

group discussion to produce ideas or solve problems.

Your table would probably work best on a special cabinet that lays flat can be accessed on top and bottom. I haven't seen one like it though.
 
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