Loafer said:
You are serious John? You believe that the only reason for a lack of discussion for D/A's is to hide things? Whatever about the guy getting the D/A? Does he not have any rights to privacy?!? For the record, many who received D/A's would certainly have enjoyed discussion, but I know for a fact many would rather it be kept on the low key.
I agree its a difficult balance. What I do feel surprised though, is that if someone wants to discuss their own D/A's, they are certainly allowed to do so and we've had "open" discussions before. So from that perspective, people who get one and want to discuss can, while those who don't want to don't. Everyone SHOULD be happy here.
Naturally, I understand history's role here, and thus why there is value in that open concept. But I find that's a heck of a leap of faith between openess and respect for individual confidences.
BTW, during the 18-24 months I was admin at VPF, I do not believe we EVER modified our guidelines without posting a message explaining the changes and why we were doing it. Hopefully, the MTS section hasn't been archived and thus you can entertain yourselves with a few of these posts. I'm amazed at the false information you guys love to put out and I think I see this as a very childish game. No one to question it makes it facts and thus, anyone reading this thread has a new BS opinion of VPF. I'm very much disappointed. Whatever happened to asking and verifying? Myself and a few others worked damn hard to change some of this BS perception and you guys are managing to flush everything down the drain with stupidiness. Now I know you mentioned Datadragon, so you are mentioning an old example that dates back, but you never mention if you feel this no longer occures and I'd challenge that your journalistic technique, if not incorrect, would belong more in the National Enquirer than the New York Post!
How does it feel John, to be treated like a child at your age? About the same as I'm feeling being shit on I suppose. If I misunderstood the criticism above, then I'm sorry, but you've both managed to piss me off more than Shockman. At least he believes he's been foobared from a misinterpration of facts, but he's honest in his conviction and thus why part of me will ALWAYS respect him. This "piss on VPF" from guys who know better certainly is not. Deal with the facts, challenge me on anything. Obviously as Shiva's stated, there's some confidentiality stuff I can't go, but I'll answer truthfully about anything I can.
As for the avatar, to quote Monty Python, "do your worse" :)
StevOz: I do appreciate your candid response. I gather we'll have to agree to disagree I guess. I will say that if the site owner's policy were to indicate "open up the D/A", I wouldn't lose sleep over it, I'm ok with either way myself. I really don't see one as evil over another, both have reasons that don't go into the "hiding info" dreamstate.
Yes, I'm very serious Loaf, and maybe you should read my comments again, since you don't seem to have comprehended them the first time. What I said was that the reason D/A are not made public knowledge is to avoid debate and discussion about each D/A. I'm of the opinion that if a person violates those "guidelines" which are actaully rules, they lose their right to any privacy, beyond that affored by their avatar. Sort of You Do The Crime You Do The Time on a much smaller basis.
Now it's interesting that you feel since I mentioned DataDragon and his Unauthorized Edit, which I know happened because I rewrote the final Edited version, that I need to mention if I feel that sort of thing still happens. So now I have to no only prove my accusations, but also fluff up the reputations and egos of any and all staff since then. Well, although you'ere a trip Loaf, I like you, and have stated repeatedly that you did an excellent job.
As far as I know, none of the rules were re-edited while you were in charge. Now I do know that they were re-edited by someone shortly before you took over, and I won't say which HE did the editing, since I only have very strong suspicions. And it wasn't AJ, who probably doesn't even know it happened.
But so what, there really is no need to edit and re-edit rules, it's much easier to simply allow each moderator to interpret the rules their own way, with little or no guidence from AJ or the main Admin.
I just don't see why there have to be so many rules, especially beyond thwe Modded Table Rules, which of course we abide by here. Besides that, we ask folks to respect themselves and others enough not to make complete fools of themselves.
Personally I'd like to see you back in charge at vpf Loaf, you have a knack for common sense and a way of smoothing ruffled feathers. While I don't agree with most of the vpf rules, I do respect you and your efforts to calm the churning waters.
The big difference between here and vpf, here you can voice your opinon, no matter what it is, and know that when you return in a day or two, the thread will still be open, and you'll still be able to post in it. And if you happen to use a hell, damn, or some other such word, it won't be ****'d out, since they are only words, and even youngsters have heard and read much worse. We're lining proof that folks can disagree and still get along,
John
ldman
